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Thread: Sold on LEDs

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    Default Sold on LEDs

    I took the plunge and purchased LEDs to replace the exterior lights, except for the plate lights. So far I replaced all but the lights under the bumper. I'll probably get to those this weekend. I did check the current flow with the LEDs, and it is now 2.6A. I didn't measure the current before the switch, but I estimated it to be approximately 7.9A. (For the record, I was expecting about 2.9A at this point of changing out the lights.) I purchased all of the bulbs from Superbright LEDs.

    Here is what I selected for my 260Z

    Front side markers - 67-A9
    Rear side markers - 67-R9

    Rear stop/tail 1157-R12
    Rear turn 1156-R12
    Rear tail 67-R9

    Front turn 1157-A12

    Reverse lights 67-W9

    License plate 67-W9

    Of course, you need to make sure the electrical connections in your car are in good shape. Also, check the sockets of the side markers. They can and WILL get rusty. I have some replacements sitting in my garage. They will go on my car VERY soon.
    Last edited by SteveJ; 12-09-2010 at 07:16 PM.
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    Steve-
    Let us know how this works for you once you get them installed. I had a buddy this fall that had a '65 Cobra totaled due to low visibility in the evening (and a woman not paying attention). Brighter lights are a good thing!!
    Life's a journey; enjoy the ride!

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    Chillin Inf's Avatar
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    How are the beam patterns of the bulbs?
    -Andrew

    03/72 240Z HLS30-70xxx - R.I.P. 2011/01/04

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    Did you need to use the resister gadget for the turn signal bulbs?

    I have read that some of the flashers didn't flash because the LEDs changed the resistance of the circuit.
    Drive Responsibly.
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    Watching this like a hawk! Thanks for the info so far and keep us up to date. Did you select wide or narrow angle LED's? and does the factory flasher relay work with the lower LED currents?
    Last edited by cygnusx1; 12-09-2010 at 09:19 PM.
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    I've had a 240Z totaled from the rear and wanted a brighter light. I wanted to go with LED lights. The problem is in New Jersey the law only allows LED lights if they originally came on the vehicle. This might not stop me if you can't tell that they are a bunch of LEDs.

    Could you take picture with them all light up for me I'd like to see how it looks?

    I like they have bulbs that have the duel intensity and are designed for turn signals. Originally on the first Z I was going to make the LED upgrade and was researching the stuff then I took a job in NJ and found out I couldn't have them. Anyways at that time you needed special components to control the flashers and brake lights, so I planned to use the wire connectors and make it all plug into the factory wire connectors so I would not need to modify the factory wires.

    One other problem that isn't a bad thing is the bulbs fadeout they don't really burnout. If you add more power as they fade out you can maintain the brightness. How it was explained to me is that the bulb wears out it will increase resistance, to counter that more power can be supplied to gap that resistance. I was also going to add to that wire a resister designed for LED bulbs, they add power as the resistance goes up. Now that they have bulbs with the flashers and duel brake light bulbs I might wait if I get them to see how long they last before adding these resistors, it might not be worth it anymore.

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    "(caps lock is stuck on my ancient work computer)"
    looks like another dollar sign to add to my list...lol...anyone asking about brightness or fadeing let me assurre you that i work equiping police and government vehicels and all the emergency lights are going to led for their brightness and long life spans...not to mention most of them only pull milliamps...in general led turn/stopp /marker lights will last years longer than the car they are in...unless you happin to get a bad batch
    1971 240z White VIN: HLS30 10068 L24 013529 E31 09/70

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    I went with the wide beam pattern. From a subjective standpoint, they seemed to be at least as bright as the incandescent bulbs. Andrew - Did you look at the Superbright LEDs website? They have a good description of their lighting patterns.

    I'll try to remember to take a picture of the tail lights, and I'll put a couple of the incandescent bulbs in to see if I can demonstrate a difference. To me, it's difficult to capture a decent picture of automotive lighting, especially with a digital camera.

    I'm not too worried about the LED fade. My car is garaged, and about the only time I drive it with the lights on is when I'm going to a club meeting. Even then, I frequently drive my daily driver to the meetings.

    Unless the previous owner put in electronic flashers, the car has the thermal ones. I have electronic flashers in the package, waiting to go in. However, with only the front lights to go, the blinkers still work with the old flasher. I will update again after I replace the front bulbs.

    FYI - Notice the current drop that I mentioned in my first post for the parking lights. The reason why thermal flashers have trouble with LEDs is because there isn't enough current to heat up the metal strip in the flasher in a timely manner. See How Stuff Works for a demo of a thermal flasher unit.

    The power consumed by the resistor is proportional to the square of the current flowing through it. A turn signal operates 3 bulbs: front, back, and interior indicator. Using power ratings of 23W for the exterior and 3.4W interior, the incandescent bulbs generate 3.5A per side (at 14V). The LED current draw for the bulbs I'm using (per Superbright LEDs) is 60mA. Just replacing one exterior bulb doesn't increase the resistance in the lights to prevent the resistor in the flasher from heating up. However, replacing both bulbs means that the lowest resistance leg of the blinker circuit would be the indicator light. I won't be surprised if the thermal flasher stops working at that point. Maybe I'll get real geeky and do all of the calculations.
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    Why No Headlights?

    FWIW,
    Carl B.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveJ View Post
    I won't be surprised if the thermal flasher stops working at that point. Maybe I'll get real geeky and do all of the calculations.
    On the flasher at least you didn't remove all the bulbs so you know it works with the front bulbs being the old stuff.

    That's not as bad as some of the things I do at work (for geekyness) like measuring the flow rate of tree sap. The are the leaves cover in a tree just to name some of the dorky things I do at times not to mention the ever fashionable forest surveyors vest with the built in backpack section for extra marking paint and lunch.

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    Forestry work sounds good to me, except, are there forests in NJ? . Maybe I will just switch out all the corner marker lights, plate, dome, and tails, to LED, but leave the rest alone. That should lighten some load and still leave the blinker circuits factory.
    Last edited by cygnusx1; 12-10-2010 at 08:25 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl Beck View Post
    Why No Headlights?

    FWIW,
    Carl B.
    I have a set of relays for the headlights. They are from Blackdragon. However, I'm waiting on replacement sockets so I can use standard SPDT relays instead of the hard-to-find SPST relays the kit comes with. After I get the relays operational I MIGHT then consider headlight upgrades.

    The big driver for the LED parking lights was the fact that when I changed out the combo switch on my car, I saw significant damage to the connector due to the parking light circuit wiring overheating. After spending the time to replace the harness side connector, I decided to reduce the current load on the circuit to prevent future melt-downs. Considering how many 240Zs have melted the fusebox for the same circuit, I'm definitely planning this for my 73. It's cheaper than an MSA replacement fusebox.
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    If you used LED Headlights - would you still need the relays etc?

    Carl B.

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    That's one of my next projects -- LED conversion. It's a simple thing and will add so much life to our crusty electrical systems.

    About LED fade: Strictly speaking, LEDs don't really fade (much). They just keep cranking away until one day they fail. However, that's not true in practice with WHITE LEDs. White LEDs are really blue/near UV LEDs that are coated with phosphors. When the phosphors are hit with the higher energy near UV and blue light, they fluoresce at a variety of longer wavelengths, adding to the blue light that comes through the phosphors to create white light. Over time the phosphors degrade significantly, resulting in very dull light.

    So when you convert to LED bulbs, make sure to buy the ones that come in colors (e.g. amber or red) wherever possible. They'll keep their brightness very well, as compared to their white counterparts.

    OH, and flashers: The electronic ones are VERY cheap and easy to substitute. Both the turn signal and hazard flashers are under the dash (at least in my '78). I got generic electronic ones and made mounts for them out of PVC pipe. They sell load resistors to run LED lights with thermal flashers, but I don't know why anyone would want to go through the trouble/expense of LED conversion and then load the thermal flashers with power resistors -- except maybe to be kinder to the bulb sockets.
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    Carl, I don't think LED headlights would require headlight relays. The problem is that I don't think anyone makes LED headlights for our cars. I think Lexus has introduced LED headlights, but I think they're ahead of the curve.

    Almost on that subject, I've seen cheap LED driving lights at the auto parts store. Has anyone tried these? I wouldn't put them on my Z (kinda tacky, plasticky things), but they look great for boating -- particularly on our sailboat (where power budgets are very stingy).
    My last three sports cars while I still owned all three:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl Beck View Post
    If you used LED Headlights - would you still need the relays etc?

    Carl B.
    I did a search for LED headlights in Google Shopping. Most of the offerings weren't for actual LEDs. There were a lot of products that had an LED halo around an H4 light. The few times that I saw a completely LED headlight was for a product from Trucklite, and it was about $300 for pretty much anywhere. I'm just not ready to fork out that much, especially for the gains that can be had with H4 lights and relays at less than half that cost.

    As for relays on LED headlights, I think it depends in part on the health of the wiring and combo switch in the headlight circuit. Relays will always only draw in the milliamp range and should be good down to 8VDC or so. If you recall from my write up 10 years ago on relays in the headlight circuit, I saw 9 VDC in my 73 at the headlight plug before installing relays. Even LED headlights would draw more current than relays. Relays would move the true power burden over to new wiring. You would get better voltage and probably better light output. While I haven't ever tried hooking up LEDs to a power supply to quantify response, but I do know there is some sort of proportionality of light output to voltage levels.
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    I'm watching this thread rather intently. Do have a question. From the website you posted it look like the bulbs are straight up replacements. I might of missed this but other than making sure the wire harness is good is there anything else I should do?

    Jan
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    If you replace all of the 1157 style bulbs (dual filament), you'll need electronic flashers for the turn signals and hazard light circuits.
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    I just did all the dash lights in the 620.Some of the factory dash bulbs that are listed as drawing 3.4 watts,now draw .27 watts.Start adding them up and it makes a difference.
    Faster than anyone in Oceanside

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    I was originally going to put LED's in my Z, but I just liked to originals so I stuck with them. So, I will make a heck of a deal for my entire set -just maybe get a few $$$ back out of my original investment.
    I have the entire set excluding running lamps and headlamps for a '78 Z.
    So, if anyone is interested please PM me.
    Last edited by ZCurves; 12-11-2010 at 07:44 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FastWoman View Post
    The problem is that I don't think anyone makes LED headlights for our cars.
    Someone at the Z Car Convention this year - had 7" LED Headlights installed in his 240Z. I ask him to send me a picture of them taken at night -so I could see how bright they were and what the light pattern looked like. Haven't received the picture yet...

    I didn't ask him how much they cost..

    FWIW,
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    Quote Originally Posted by FastWoman View Post
    ... The problem is that I don't think anyone makes LED headlights for our cars. ...

    Almost on that subject, I've seen cheap LED driving lights at the auto parts store. Has anyone tried these? I wouldn't put them on my Z (kinda tacky, plasticky things), but they look great for boating -- particularly on our sailboat (where power budgets are very stingy).
    http://www.truck-lite.com/webapp/wcs...0001&langId=-1

    I have considered the LED driving lights, but decided to give them a few more years to "mature" before I really got serious about it. For now Halogens will have to suffice.

    I was interested in the explanation of why white LED's fade. So in essence "White" LEDs are actually LED powered florescent bulbs. (replacing the mercury vapor with an ultraviolet LED.) I wondered how they got the white light out of them.
    '71 240Z, Because any fool can drive fast in a straight line.

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    Here's a quick update...

    I finally got around to putting in the front turn signal lights. When I was putting in the driver side bulb, I didn't push and twist enough for the bayonet to lock in. The end result was that the bulb fell out of the socket as I was lining up the socket to go back in. Getting the bulb back out of the housing wasn't fun, either. Instead of taking off the housing (in of itself being a monumental task due to the rust on the bolt), I tried fishing it out by grabbing it with a parts grabber. I might as well have been trying to grab a greased pig. I eventually put tape on my finger so the bulb would stick to it, and when the bulb was finally within reach, I grabbed it with a pair of long nosed pliers. Upon getting the bulb properly seated in the socket, I re-installed the socket.

    I put the car in run and tried the left turn signal. As expected, it did not blink. Having learned from my mini-ordeal with the driver side, I installed the passenger side turn signal light with no drama.

    The next challenge was to find the electronic flasher units. Having searched many liking hiding places, I asked my wife to join the hunt due to the fact that she has a finding gene that I have never managed to locate within myself. After describing the packaging and when the flashers arrived, we set about to track them down. Eventually, my wife mentioned that she had put some parts in the passenger seat. Of course, those parts were the flashers.

    I installed one flasher and tested the blinkers and hazards. They did not blink. I installed the second unit, and the lights flashed at a rate faster than I had ever seen on either of my Z cars. I consider this a good thing and recommend that people experiment with electronic flashers even if they have the standard incandescent bulbs.

    I did not take pictures, yet. It was just too cold today for me to go outside and play with a camera. Maybe I'll take some next weekend or during my Christmas time off. However, subjectively, I'm VERY pleased with the results.
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    Marooned Fish cygnusx1's Avatar
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    Why, do you suspect, did the first flasher unit not work? Glad to hear you got it working though! Very excited to see the results.
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    Dave, I haven't taken my deep dive to try to figure out why I needed both changed to get either circuit to work. It is on my list, though. I'm curious about whether or not I can develop a plausible explanation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cygnusx1 View Post
    Why, do you suspect, did the first flasher unit not work? Glad to hear you got it working though! Very excited to see the results.
    The old school flasher units required a higher resistance, since LED have practically none there is a faster flash. Make sure to replace both the Turn-Signal Flasher relay and the Hazard Flasher relay with current electronic units.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZCurves View Post
    The old school flasher units required a higher resistance, since LED have practically none there is a faster flash. Make sure to replace both the Turn-Signal Flasher relay and the Hazard Flasher relay with current electronic units.
    To be precise, the LEDs consume less power, so less current is flowing through the circuit and therefore the flasher unit. Since power is proportional to the square of the current, there isn't enough heat produced in the flasher to deflect the switch.

    What I found curious is that replacing one flasher for an electronic flasher did not make it where either the turn signals or hazard lights would blink. Both flasher units had to be installed to get either circuit to blink. I was under the assumption that the flashers were independent of each other electrically, so I assumed that replacing one flasher would allow either the turn signals or the hazard lights to blink.
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    Sounds like you're becoming the resident LED expert. Guess this means I can take a break for a while...

    I decided to do the LED thing a few years back and have gone nuts on it all. The only 2 incandescent bulbs on the whole car are the license plate lights. I made my Map light LED array, my dome light circuit board, custom cut 4) 12 LED sidemarker lights from the Kenworth Shop, Custom made the LED plates on the Tail lights and front markers and tore the gauges apart to remove the green lenses and paint the insides silver before installing "SuperbriteLED's" and MSA white face gauge overlays. I used the the White Wide angle ba9's in the dash.

    5mm super whites in the map and dome light boards
    5mm 18K mcd Red LED's in the brake light boards
    5mm 12K mcd Yellow LED's in the front marker boards\
    Blazer 12 vdc 3 light (per side) LED electronic flasher
    12" white Cold Cathode tube lights (4) underdash and domelight area
    Maxxima* 12 LED clearance lights 2) red 2) amber for the sidemarkers
    Alpena White Flexible LED strips just above the front bumpers for that Audi look.
    H4 6000K HID headlights in Autopal housings.

    Here's a couple shots but I really need to redo them now that I'm finally figuring out this new camera from last year....
    Dave
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    Last edited by Zs-ondabrain; 12-13-2010 at 11:06 PM.
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    Dave, what I love about these LEDs I used is that they are just drop in replacements. I really like how your tail lights turned out, but frankly, I'm just too lazy to try to go to the lengths you did. Anyway, given what I've seen and read about the parking light circuit, I can't overemphasize the value of a solution like this. To me it's even easier to implement than your relay solution.

    The dash lights are on the list for me. I just need to get smarter on taking out the gauges.
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    Dave, I like the work you did. Don't ever get NJ tags. I'm hoping Steve's looks a lot less obvious.

    Dave, how was it making the LED boards?

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    240Z Elec. Upgrade guy Zs-ondabrain's Avatar
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    I use 1/8" Black ABS plastic. Then I use a counter sinking bit on my drill press at an exact depth to allow the LED's to squeeze thru the plate and sit further into the plate, which in turn allows more LED body to be pushed thru the opening.

    Then I sand the plate face smooth, spray glue the face and regular aluminum foil for a reflective surface, cut out each hole then load the LED's into the board. Bend the leads so the grounds all connect with each other then wire in the resistors (2 LED's per resistor).

    The larger plate has 2 mounting screw in the middle and the smaller board has 2 screws also, one on each outer edge. Then I take 2) 1157 bulbs and break the glass out of them, unsolder the leads and clean the inside out. Then I wire in the ground, brake and parking light wires and back fill with hot glue. Then all you have to do is plug them in like a regular bulb into the socket.

    I also repaint the center of the chrome strip, polish the lenses and reglue before reassembly. And it's basically the same thing in the front. The sidemarkers are more of a plug and play deal but also do the hollowed out bulb base so things can go back to stock if I (or the customer) ever decide otherwise.

    Yes, it takes a lot of labor and many hours of plate cutting, drilling, wiring, soldering, polishing and gluing and screwing, BUT it's all worth it in the end to have a STOCK looking taillight that lights up the road behind you and has a look like no other Z. I haven't had a customer complain about people not seeing their car yet. And better yet, other people CAN see the Z's better. No excuses of "I'm sorry Officer, I didn't see his brake lights"

    And with a 100,000+ hour lifespan, they'll be around long after I'm gone. Especially since they are typically underpowered due to the Z's bad wiring.

    Below, you can see the front markers on an angled plate, with the hollowed out bulb housings and aluminum foil. I have to glue in the front plates for lack of a good screwing surface. I also use one of the reflectors from the taillights, rebend and installed into the reverse light section for better light output from the 1156 bulb. (Customers Euro taillights)

    Dave
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    Last edited by Zs-ondabrain; 12-14-2010 at 10:42 AM.
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    Dave, I'll just mention, since you're making your own, that an LED enthusiast friend of mine lost most of the LED lighting in his RV when a voltage regulator went bad. His off-the-shelf, mass-marketed LED lights used drop resistors, and just a bit of an overvoltage can result in a fatal spike in current.

    I have another LED enthusiast friend who manufactures LED lights for marine use. He uses transistors instead of drop resistors to limit current through the LEDs. That way you regulate current with a resistor on the base of the transistor, and voltage spikes aren't nearly so consequential (with respect to the entire supply voltage, rather than with respect to the top end of the voltage range above the forward bias voltage of the stack). Food for thought.
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    Sarah, why not use a 78XX as voltage regulator then.

    Chris
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    Default Finally...Pictures

    I finally took some pictures of the taillights. I swapped the incandescent bulbs from the right to the left to reduce the influence of any exhaust soot affecting the perception of the lights.

    In my opinion, the 1157 incandescent bulbs are SLIGHTLY brighter. However, I have some LED 1157 equivalents with more LEDs. They do require taking apart the taillight to install since the LED bulb is larger than the opening for the socket. The 67 LED equivalent does seem to be a little brighter, though.

    Considering the drop in current flow through the circuit, I'm still VERY happy with the results.
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    Sorry if i missed this earlier but could you point me to a good source for and explanation of installing the electronic flashers? I am thinking of doing this myself
    Cheers

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    240Z Elec. Upgrade guy Zs-ondabrain's Avatar
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    Almost all the auto parts stores carry the correct Electronic Flashers, now-a-days.

    If you have regular bulbs, non-LED, then just grab a standard 2 prong Electronic Flasher. I think I installed a "Blazer" HD Elec. Flasher (3-bulb) in the 72' Green Z as it was all stock lighting. Only cost about $9.

    If you have LED's in front and rear, then you'll need to get an LED specific Electronic Flasher. They typically have 3 pins and the 3rd pin needs to be Grounded.

    Dave
    Last edited by Zs-ondabrain; 12-26-2010 at 11:36 PM.
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    Thanks Dave, do these just install in place of the stock flasher?

    I am not so good with car electrical. Sorry if I am asking stupid questions
    Cheers

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    yes, the 2 pin electronic flasher will plug into the same 2 wires that your Thermal flasher used right now. There should be a green wire and a white wire attached to your present flasher. The white is from the turn signal flasher and the green is from the fusebox.

    There should be a + symbol on the new flasher and I believe the green wire goes there.

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    I did this recently on my 914. One of the first things I noticed was that they were significantly brighter than the originals, which to be fair were probably 40 years old. But still, noticeably brighter. Second thing I noticed was the volt meter change. I had noticed prior to this that whenever my turn signals were on I could watch the volt meter move up and down with the blinking. Also, when the brakes were applied the meter would drop to 12 volts. I still have the drop but not as dramatic and the turn signal draw is no longer visible. I can only conclude that they draw less besides being brighter.
    As for laws on LED lights in cars not originally equipped, I wouldn't worry about it. For a LEO to find out you have LED lights without your admitting to it would require a consent search. It would have to be a pretty slow day for a LEO to be busting people for LED lights. You would have to have given him or her some other probably cause to bring about the interaction and they would only throw an LED light violation on to stack your offenses.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zealous View Post
    Thanks Dave, do these just install in place of the stock flasher?

    I am not so good with car electrical. Sorry if I am asking stupid questions
    Please be aware that there are two flashers in your car. One is for the hazard lights, and the other is for the turn signals.

    I purchased the Bussmann 232 flashers for my cars.
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    question, are the REAR brake lights/turn signal dual or single filament? 1157 or 1073? how about the reverse lights?

    i notice when i hit brakes, all three bulbs go on and the same applies when the turn signal is on (makes me think someone put single filament bulbs in the car i just bought).

    i actually dont like the fact the entire tail light section blinks when the turn signal is on.

    is it possible to make it where the top section is strictly just brake and parking light. and the bottom half is just brake, parking light, and turn signal? i wonder if this can be accomplished by merely putting single filament on top section and dual filament on the bottom section (i'll laugh if this is the original setup and i just had the wrong bulbs installed).

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    240Z Elec. Upgrade guy Zs-ondabrain's Avatar
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    You have a 71' That's the way they are supposed to light up.
    So start giggling....

    The payyern changed thru out the years but yours is supposed to be all 3 bulbs for brake and 2 parking lights when no brake applied. Later years had the 2 outer most bulbs as brakes.

    Dual filiment is for parking light and brake light, Typically 1157 up top and 1156 on the bottom lense as well as the reverse light.
    Last edited by Zs-ondabrain; 01-06-2011 at 01:38 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zs-ondabrain View Post
    You have a 71' That's the way they are supposed to light up.
    So start giggling....

    The payyern changed thru out the years but yours is supposed to be all 3 bulbs for brake and 2 parking lights when no brake applied. Later years had the 2 outer most bulbs as brakes.

    Dual filiment is for parking light and brake light, Typically 1157 up top and 1156 on the bottom lense as well as the reverse light.
    thanks. as the OP was mentioning about replacing 1157 with LED bulbs, would i get the hyper blinker issue? i do have a late model '70 and the turn signal blinks extremely slow compared to modern day cars. i would actually prefer a faster blinking turn signal (i would imagine the hyper blinking problem would speed up the factory blink rate).

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    Quote Originally Posted by bavarian06 View Post
    thanks. as the OP was mentioning about replacing 1157 with LED bulbs, would i get the hyper blinker issue? i do have a late model '70 and the turn signal blinks extremely slow compared to modern day cars. i would actually prefer a faster blinking turn signal (i would imagine the hyper blinking problem would speed up the factory blink rate).
    If you replaced all of the exterior lights for your turn signals with LEDs, your lights will STOP blinking with the old thermal flasher units. This is because the current flow through the unit drops to a point that the resistive element will not heat up enough to break the circuit.

    I replaced BOTH the turn signal and hazard flashers with Bussmann 232 electronic flasher units. I found them on eBay. I cannot say for sure that electronic flasher units would speed up the blink rate for incandescent bulbs, but I would expect that they would.
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    Steve - I installed all the LED's today to include the Dashboard replacements. What a wonderful way to spend a Saturday. Job that should have taken me 2 hours MAX took me 7 hours. Dirty Lens covers, Speedo cables, kids, dog, all kinds of drama. The end product was so worth the effort. I just need to get the Tach back from Michigan to have the dash back together again.

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    Okay, so about a year later, I finally got around to replacing the lights in my tachometer with LEDs. After reinstalling, I noticed the turn signals didn't function correctly. I went back and replaced the LEDs in the turn signal indicators with the old incandescent bulbs, and the turn signals worked again. Apparently the Bussman electronic flashers still need enough current to flash at the proper rate. The drop in current with the LEDs caused the problem.
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    You need to look for an LED specific Electronic Flasher module. I think I'm using a "Blazer" or "Tridon" EP35.
    I think it's a 3-4 light T/S or 6-8 Hazard. (works for both, so get 2 once you find the one that works best for your Application)

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    Hope this wasn't answered already - the thread is sorta over my head (managed to hook Dave's headlight harness to itself).While changing a rear turn signal bulb, noticed a lot of heat there when the lights were on, so want to change what I can to LED's without digging into the flashers. Can I just swap the single filiment bulbs ? 67-R9's? If I don't change the front turn signals will the dual-filament LED's (1157-R12?) work OK?
    BTW, don't use Black Dragon harness mentioned in this thread - made in China and a bit cheezy, had to trash it.

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    Digging into the flashers? They are easy to access under the dash on the driver's side. However, if you leave the front turn signals as incandescent bulbs, your old flashers should work, though they might blink at a slower rate.
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    The correct Electronic flasher will flash at the same rat, no matter the mix of LED VS. filiment bulb.
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    I also have the LED's installed (All of the bulbs in the car have been replaced). Steve and I talked about the problem with the flashers not flashing correctly. I read Dave's reply about the flasher assembly and figured I would give it a try before taking the Tach back out and replacing the LED bulbs I have in the Turn Signal flashers.

    I initially tried it with the Tridon EP35 and ran a ground wire and for the life of me it would not work. I went back to the FSM and had a look at it appears the poles are reversed. Note: I am doing this work on an early 260Z.
    So I created two jumpers and crossed the poles back to the factory flasher plug and magically everything worked. Needless to say having my flashers back working correctly no matter the engine RPM or speed was a joy. So for giggles I went back to the parts store and had a look. It turns out the Tridon EP34 reverses the positive and the negative poles on the flasher assembly. I thought surely it can't be that simple. I bought it; walked into the parking lot and plugged it into the factory flasher plug and moved the ground over. Now it works with the factory plug (Did have to add the ground wire as Dave mentions)

    Thanks Steve for the info on the LED's and thanks Dave for the note about the Electronic Flashers.

    One more thing: The bussman 232 that Steve said to use is an electronic flasher but I did notice something when I was at the parts store. It didnt say it was compatible with LED Bulbs. Both the EP34 and EP35 say they are LED Compatible and are only $12.

    Hope this helps.
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    Last edited by thomas461; 08-11-2012 at 11:34 AM.
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    And for Clarity......

    L = Load (to the lights/turn signal/hazards)
    E / G / - = Earth / Ground / Negative
    B / + = Battery / Positive / Power In

    Thank you for this Pete (Thomas461) and any others who add to the thread.
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    Thanks doing the research, Pete.
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    Quote Originally Posted by conedodger View Post
    As for laws on LED lights in cars not originally equipped, I wouldn't worry about it. For a LEO to find out you have LED lights without your admitting to it would require a consent search. It would have to be a pretty slow day for a LEO to be busting people for LED lights.
    This quote is a few years old now, but why why would the officer pull you over (in 2010?) I've never heard of it happening lately, or back then even. Was it some kind of equipment violation, like not having "bulbs" in your lamps?
    Last edited by TomoHawk; 10-19-2014 at 06:25 PM.
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    Thanks for dragging this thread up Tomo. Forgotabout it. Good reading it again
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