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Thread: 1971 Fairlady Z one owner on CL

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    Default 1971 Fairlady Z one owner on CL


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    Her Majesty the 26th 26th-Z's Avatar
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    If anyone goes to look at this car, please photograph the steering wheel and post the pictures,please. It looks like it may be the rare 48400-E4100 leather covered wheel. Very rare - very valuable. Would love to see more detailed pics to verify. Thanks!
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    Low rez Craig's list photos really piss me off. Could be a real nice car.
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    Default 71 fairlady

    i went to take a look at this car this weekend... wow! what a beautiful car. everything on it was well taken care of, no visible rust whats so ever, and it started up and drove amazing. well, here are some pics of the steering wheel and some additional pics. how can you tell if this is the rare 48400-E4100 leather covered wheel? sorry, i havent done my research...
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    VIN: S3004679 if anyone wants to do a check on it

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    Sadly it's not the super-rare option 48400-E4100 leather steering wheel ( not to be confused with the Sports Option 'Datsun Compe', which had a 'leather look' moulded urethane rim ). It's just the stock wood composite wheel with a loose leather cover stitched around it. Horn push 'Z' is the correct blue-painted version - correct for this model. The wheel should be less dish ( ie flatter ) than the Export steering wheels. Steering wheel re-trim probably done by the same outfit which recovered the door panels?

    Mid January to early February 1971 build date I reckon.

    Quite a nice car. Many of the mods could still be reversed.

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    Thanks for the pictures! Leather aftermarket cover, I'm afraid. Well, there's your answer, Alan.
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    Did you find out if they have the original engine? The ad says they think it has an L28 installed, but may have the original engine in storage. Does it still have the original five speed transmission? What does the dash look like under the cover?

    -Mike

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    Beautiful car indeed. Unfortunately Fairlady Z's, at least the ones in Japan, did not receive an engine code on the engine bay plate. To verify, you can general guess the range of the engine code based on build date. Like my Fairlady, it didn't suffer from the addition of the rear red reflectors! Mostly all Fairlady's I have seen in the States had this item added to be road legal in the 70's. The door panels, steering wheel, front grill, among others will need to changed back, but awesome condition!
    Last edited by spitz17; 01-31-2012 at 08:50 AM.
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    Mike B
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    Quote Originally Posted by spitz17 View Post
    Unfortunately Fairlady Z's, at least the ones in Japan, did not receive an engine code on the engine bay plate. To verify, you can general guess the range of the engine code based on build date.
    Yes, but if it's a S30 it should have an L20a, not a L24, so if the engine in storage is an L20a, that is probably the original engine.

    Quote Originally Posted by spitz17 View Post
    Like my Fairlady, it didn't suffer from the addition of the rear red reflectors! Mostly all Fairlady's I have seen in the States had this item added to be road legal in the 70's.
    It must have varied by state, or maybe it was just California cars that had to add them. Most of the early Fairladys I have seen in the US didn't have the rear reflectors.

    -Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike B View Post
    Did you find out if they have the original engine? The ad says they think it has an L28 installed, but may have the original engine in storage. Does it still have the original five speed transmission? What does the dash look like under the cover?

    -Mike
    i asked about the engine, but they were not 100% sure. they only assume it was the original engine and matching transmission because the owner (who has passed away) was they type of person that would not store "junk"... they told me that the owner would buy extra parts for the car just in case they were not available in the future. they said that the storage locker contains a whole rear end or rear axel part, a head, the block, a cam, seat covers and cushions, whole ac unit, the blower and condenser, z wheel caps, etc.. i cant remember the rest.

    the dash has 2 cracks, one small one near the driver side and a larger one on the passenger. but still in great condition for a 40 year old car.

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    There do appear to be some things that it appears someone added to this car. We have one known to be correct in most aspects as a JDM. No bumper overriders, no decals like that on air cleaner, and those louvers in the small doors next to the hood are not stock. At least not by our car, nor the pictures in the Nissan books. And of course those are aftermarket wheels. Radiator hoses are aftermarket replacements as are the clamps. Ours is appraised at well over the $20k he is asking. There are not many of these left in the USA and very few have been "restored". It can be done if you are willing to chase parts all over the world.
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    Our 1971 FairladyZ-L has the original L20 engine, not an "L20A" ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike B View Post
    Yes, but if it's a S30 it should have an L20a, not a L24, so if the engine in storage is an L20a, that is probably the original engine.



    It must have varied by state, or maybe it was just California cars that had to add them. Most of the early Fairladys I have seen in the US didn't have the rear reflectors.

    -Mike

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    Are trying to sell a car, indirectly? The post you replied to is over two years old. If so, say so.
    1976 280Z, with some minor modifications

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    Our 1971 doesn't have the red markers; it was imported without them in the early 1970s and has always been licensed in Oregon without a problem ... or an engine bay id plate which was "lost" during a repaint three decades ago ...

    Quote Originally Posted by spitz17 View Post
    Beautiful car indeed. Unfortunately Fairlady Z's, at least the ones in Japan, did not receive an engine code on the engine bay plate. To verify, you can general guess the range of the engine code based on build date. Like my Fairlady, it didn't suffer from the addition of the rear red reflectors! Mostly all Fairlady's I have seen in the States had this item added to be road legal in the 70's. The door panels, steering wheel, front grill, among others will need to changed back, but awesome condition!

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    Not selling, just sharing information about a 1971 FairladyZ-L that is mostly correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zed Head View Post
    Are trying to sell a car, indirectly? The post you replied to is over two years old. If so, say so.

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    No offense intended. A new thread with a link to this one might work also.
    1976 280Z, with some minor modifications

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
    Our 1971 FairladyZ-L has the original L20 engine, not an "L20A" ....
    The engine your 1971 Fairlady Z-L left the factory with was called an 'L20A' by Nissan. The 'A' suffix was added to the L20 sixes when the L20 four debuted ( 'L20A' = 6 cyl, 'L20B' = 4 cyl ) in an attempt to avoid confusion.

    You won't necessarily see the suffix codes written anywhere on the car itself.

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    I have two Nissan Fairlady brochure booklets, both are in Japanese. I got one on leave in Japan, in Nov. 1971, A 12 page brochure. It showed 6 options for the Fairladys. the 240ZG, 240Z-L, 240Z, FairladyZ-L, & FairladyZ. A rally clock, radio, chrome rimmed headlight bucket lenses, rear defogger, rear spoiler, & hubcaps. For the 70 Fairlady 432Z, FairladyZ-L, and FairladyZ they had 12 pictured. 8 track, foot rest, spoiler, rear window defogger, bumper overriders, side lower racing stripe, what looks like black vinyl top, custom exhaust tips, rectangular fog lights, radio, rally clock and two others showing lower doorway opening aluminum strip, and the flasher button on the turn signal. Also showed 7 colors.
    10/69 Fairlady ZL 5-speed
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    As is often the case, this is something we have discussed on this forum - in detail - in the past:

    http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/m...y-options.html

    http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/m...0-options.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by HS30-H View Post
    The 'A' suffix was added to the L20 sixes when the L20 four debuted ( 'L20A' = 6 cyl, 'L20B' = 4 cyl ) in an attempt to avoid confusion.
    Hi Alan, wasn't the A suffix added to distinguish the L20A from the earlier L20 (1966 to 196?), which had a different valve cover design?

    Wikipedia (for want of a better source) tells me the L20B didn't debut 1974, yet from what I can tell the L20A was called that earlier than 1974.
    Last edited by Mr Camouflage; 02-23-2014 at 01:20 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Camouflage View Post
    Hi Alan, wasn't the A suffix added to distinguish the L20A from the earlier L20 (1966 to 196?), which had a different valve cover design?
    Yes, you're right. I don't think I put that very well did I? The L20 six got the 'A' suffix well before the L20 four arrived with the 'B' suffix.

    The story that was related to me when I looked into this was that it was a case of killing more than one bird with one stone. Yes, they needed to differentiate between the early style L20 six and the updated L20 six, so they started to use an 'A' suffix on the updated design. A good illustration of this was in the factory parts manual for the GC10 Skyline: This had sections for both the 'early' / 'old' type L20 six and the 'new' L20'A', as the earliest GC10s were equipped with the 'old' type L20 sixes, and then they switched to the 'new' L20'A'. It must have been quite confusing at the time to have the same model of car fitted with two versions of what was essentially the 'same' engine.

    Those first 'new' L20'A's had the 'A' stamped into the pad on the block that carried the engine number. No doubt this was an effort to make sure there was no confusion, but it's possible to see Nissan's period advertising and other technical descriptions not differentiating between the two types. I don't know whether that was deliberate or not? And just a year or so down the line ( late 1969 ) Nissan were churning out what were clearly 'new' type L20As without the 'A' being stamped on the block as part of the engine number. Quite confusing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Camouflage
    Wikipedia (for want of a better source) tells me the L20B didn't debut 1974, yet from what I can tell the L20A was called that earlier than 1974.
    Again, the story I was told was that the 4-cylinder L20 was 'on the drawing board' - or at least being mooted - during the 1968/9 period when the L20 six was updated, hence the 'A' and 'B'. Even if they were not ready to make it yet, we can imagine that they could see a 4-cylinder L-gata engine of two litre capacity being necessary somewhere in the near future. If that wasn't part of a long-term plan then it would have to be a big coincidence, no? One thing is for sure: Those 'A' and 'B' suffixes did the job of differentiating between the six and the four, and the 'old' and 'new' sixes.



    But anyway, Kerrigan's Fairlady Z-L was fitted with the 'new' type L20 six, which the factory called an 'L20A' at the time.

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    Great info as always. Thanks Alan.
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    874 lower than my 5553 ... guess on ours is a May-July build date window. The fuel pump date code is 1501 (May 71?) and a date code on the headlight wiring harness is, strangely enough, G-71 .... definitely a "G" ... not a "6" ....

    Don't think the louvered access hatches are stock ... ours doesn't have them and it's an original car.

    Nice Fairlady however; there aren't many left in the US ... just heard of another one wrecked and scrapped. Scored some parts off it.


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    Quote Originally Posted by galatea Z View Post
    VIN: S3004679 if anyone wants to do a check on it

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    Nope. The S30 has an L20 engine, with dual sidedraft Hatachi carbs, not the single downdraft carb on the L20A. At least according to the stamp on my engine block with it's dual carbs (as the car came).

    If it's a JDM FairladyZ it will not have rear side markers. And the front side markers are tied into the turn-signal and flash with them. That's stock as well on JDMs. This one anyway.

    But if we listen to the "experts" this car never existed ... it just HAD to have an L20A engine ... snicker snicker ...

    I've owned it for over 32 years and it's basically unmodified except for the wheels .... they are not stock. Oh, and the Carellos I run instead of the factory option fog lights ...

    All in all, nice car.

    $20k?

    Our Fairlady is appraised and insured for $30k ... so there must be something to be said for the "value" ....


    Quote Originally Posted by Mike B View Post
    Yes, but if it's a S30 it should have an L20a, not a L24, so if the engine in storage is an L20a, that is probably the original engine.



    It must have varied by state, or maybe it was just California cars that had to add them. Most of the early Fairladys I have seen in the US didn't have the rear reflectors.

    -Mike

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    What is so confusing to me Alan is the pictures of the L20A and the L20 in my factory service manual. The L20A is shown as having one down draft style carburetor instead of the two side-draft Hatachi carbs.
    The message I'm getting is either the Factory Service Manual is incorrect with the photos or my FairladyZ is a factory fluke. I don't find an "A" or "B" suffix stamped anywhere relating to the engine type or number, just L20 256597 stamped on the engine number pads on the engine block.

    No wonder there is much confusion about these since the factory and dealer paperwork is long gone ... at least the Nissan historian couldn't come up with anything other than "your car is an S30 model FairladyZ built in 1971."

    As I've opined many times, the only thing I really know about these cars is this one. I know the original owner in USA in the early 1970s, how he got the car, who bought it next, and I got it after that. I'm really only the second owner of it in the US as the original guy sold it via a dealer who didn't transfer the title until I bought it ... for WAY TOO MUCH money at the time ... but glad I did.

    So, this FairladyZ-L: .... came with the L20 dual carb engine (no "A", no "B" suffix engine) coupled to the 5-speed tranny ending in the R180 pumpkin, which it still has ... unmodified. And as far as we can tell, at 79000 miles the engine has never been cracked open. No valve work, no nothing. Trans is the original one never reworked (it does have a tick tick indicating a weak bearing, but nothing to tear into yet), and the rear end is untouched.

    I've repainted it to Nissan 901 with a color match to the untouched inner body hatch panels still in original paint (we think).

    These cars can be as much a mystery as anything I guess.



    Upon that I think we can agree.
    Quote Originally Posted by HS30-H View Post
    Yes, you're right. I don't think I put that very well did I? The L20 six got the 'A' suffix well before the L20 four arrived with the 'B' suffix.

    The story that was related to me when I looked into this was that it was a case of killing more than one bird with one stone. Yes, they needed to differentiate between the early style L20 six and the updated L20 six, so they started to use an 'A' suffix on the updated design. A good illustration of this was in the factory parts manual for the GC10 Skyline: This had sections for both the 'early' / 'old' type L20 six and the 'new' L20'A', as the earliest GC10s were equipped with the 'old' type L20 sixes, and then they switched to the 'new' L20'A'. It must have been quite confusing at the time to have the same model of car fitted with two versions of what was essentially the 'same' engine.

    Those first 'new' L20'A's had the 'A' stamped into the pad on the block that carried the engine number. No doubt this was an effort to make sure there was no confusion, but it's possible to see Nissan's period advertising and other technical descriptions not differentiating between the two types. I don't know whether that was deliberate or not? And just a year or so down the line ( late 1969 ) Nissan were churning out what were clearly 'new' type L20As without the 'A' being stamped on the block as part of the engine number. Quite confusing.



    Again, the story I was told was that the 4-cylinder L20 was 'on the drawing board' - or at least being mooted - during the 1968/9 period when the L20 six was updated, hence the 'A' and 'B'. Even if they were not ready to make it yet, we can imagine that they could see a 4-cylinder L-gata engine of two litre capacity being necessary somewhere in the near future. If that wasn't part of a long-term plan then it would have to be a big coincidence, no? One thing is for sure: Those 'A' and 'B' suffixes did the job of differentiating between the six and the four, and the 'old' and 'new' sixes.



    But anyway, Kerrigan's Fairlady Z-L was fitted with the 'new' type L20 six, which the factory called an 'L20A' at the time.
    Last edited by Kerrigan; 05-10-2014 at 01:32 PM. Reason: spelling error

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
    Nope. The S30 has an L20 engine, with dual sidedraft Hatachi carbs, not the single downdraft carb on the L20A. At least according to the stamp on my engine block with it's dual carbs (as the car came).
    Kerrigan, you're like some kind of Cicada. You seem to spend months under ground, then emerge, climb a tree and make a lot of noise.

    I can't understand how you can have owned your car for so long and yet know so little about it and its siblings. Does everything go in one ear and then straight out of the other? We've told you plenty about your car and the Fairlady Z / Z-L in general over the years, and yet nothing seems to stick.

    As I'm sure I've explained to you before - either on this forum or on one of the many other forums you seem to pop up on from time to time - the engine in your 1971 Fairlady Z-L was called an 'L20A' by Nissan. The 'L20A' came in single carb form ( as used in umpteen Japanese domestic sedans that you have never heard of ) and in twin carb form, as used in the S30-series Z - which you have heard of - but also in umpteen Japanese domestic sedans that you have (again) never heard of.

    Read this next part slowly. Read it out loud if it helps. THE TERMS 'L20' AND 'L20A' DO NOT DENOTE WHETHER A PARTICULAR ENGINE WAS SINGLE DOWNDRAUGHT CARB, DUAL CHOKE SINGLE DOWNDRAUGHT CARB OR DUAL CARB TYPE. Is that clear?

    I don't know if the little factory literature you have accumulated over the years includes one of the engine manuals that covers the different types of L20A engine for the Japanese market, but I assume not. If you refer only to the English language factory manuals that cover the L20A engine then you will - probably - only see single carb versions. Guess why? ( clue: it's not because the twin carb L20A didn't exist... ).

    Quote Originally Posted by Kerrigan
    But if we listen to the "experts" this car never existed ... it just HAD to have an L20A engine ... snicker snicker ...
    The joke's on you old chap. Your car had what Nissan called an 'L20A' engine. It's in all the (Japanese) literature. No need to take my "expert" word for it. Just believe Nissan themselves:
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    Default What's are the differences?

    Thought the reply was a little parental in tone, but thought I'd ask anyway ... as you seem knowledgeable ... what are the physical differences between an L20 and an L20A engine, cause I didn't find any info explaining that on the Internet? The one picture I have seen had the "L20" stamped on the first stamp block as shown below, but the engine number has an "A" stamped before the numbers on the second stamp block.
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    Guess I've been wrong about the engine in these cars. Only had an L20A, not an L20. Apparently they never had a L20.

    Amazing really, I learn something new to me about these FairladyZs every week.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
    Our 1971 FairladyZ-L has the original L20 engine, not an "L20A" ....
    Last edited by Kerrigan; 06-23-2014 at 11:06 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
    Guess I've been wrong about the engine in these cars. Only had an L20A, not an L20. Apparently they never had a L20.

    Amazing really, I learn something new to me about these FairladyZs every week.
    Many people, on several different forums, have been telling you about the L20A / L20(a) / L20 thing for months.

    So what happened? Did you hear the same story from your favourite 'expert', and only then did you believe it?

    And you wonder why people feel frustrated to deal with you...

  31. #31
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    CZCC-4680
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    Aug 2003
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    No.

    Actually when three informed people on four different forums (yes, I'll admit I cruise the forums seeking/learning new stuff,) put forth "facts" which made sense and were pretty much the same, that settled it for me.

    The pictures in the FSM are misleading, so I got mislead. By people too.

    But all is well in Fairladyville now :-)

    I was sort of surprised by some of the people who really had their tit caught in the wringer over it.

    "Some peeps always hasta put ya down" ...

    Forums are to share common interests, swap "facts", and information.

    Not a place for one to pump up their under-inflated egos .. :-)

    You think this gets bad, log onto one of the train fan forums and stick your opinion toes in the acidic waters.

    I've also collected about all the manuals and books out on the Z car and the information and instructions vary quite a bit. Some totally incorrect, some half-right, and the others helpful and accurate.

    Quote Originally Posted by HS30-H View Post
    Many people, on several different forums, have been telling you about the L20A / L20(a) / L20 thing for months.

    So what happened? Did you hear the same story from your favourite 'expert', and only then did you believe it?

    And you wonder why people feel frustrated to deal with you...

  32. #32
    Registered User Z fan's Avatar
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    CZCC-30562
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    Jun 2014
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    Maple Lawn MD
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    ^^^ I have been a lurker here before I actually made a membership in order to have access to the classified section , yes I see a few inflated egos here, there is an evident " in the clan group ".

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