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Thread: 5 speed knob reproduction?

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    1972 240z Decoy12's Avatar
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    Default 5 speed knob reproduction?

    I was wondering if anyone knows of anyone that reproduces the JDM 5 speed wooden shift knobs. I had a JDM one accidentally fall and the plastic lense/gear map shattered I was hoping that someone made a repro I could buy?

    Last edited by Decoy12; 10-04-2012 at 01:03 PM.
    -Michael

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    I'm in process of trying to make one for when I install my 5-speed. Have two fabrication paths I'm going to try.

    1) 3D printed blanks that need white paint, then I'm going to try applying some casting resin.
    2) Printed 5-speed logo on photo paper, glued to a disk and covered with casting resin.
    For both ways, once casting resin is cured hard, it can be sanded convex and polished.

    If either process works, I'll post pictures.
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
    CZC# 15388

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    1972 240z Decoy12's Avatar
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    I appreciate the response and have my fingers crossed that everything works out well! If you do succeed, would you consider making a duplicate?

    I feel terrible about losing such a part that I have been after for a while now... I saw a reproduction on ebay, but it looks off not to mention they want $200 for it...
    -Michael

    HLS30-58745

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    Registered User Oiluj's Avatar
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    Sure. If it works I plan to make several and can send you one. My first try was not a success, but I'm not giving up...
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
    CZC# 15388

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    I'm in this too-from an entirely different angle. With any luck the last of my tooling will be be here next week, with samples to show against originals the following week.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    Make one for me too, I have a 10/69 Fairlady ZL ......thanks

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    1972 240z Decoy12's Avatar
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    Thanks Julio and hls30.com for your efforts! I am glad that all is not lost... Please do keep us updated with your finds!
    -Michael

    HLS30-58745

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    I'd rather be lucky than good!

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    Still waiting on my tooling, but getting excited about the plan! When I get everything sorted out, I'll post pics side by side with the new Nissan version and my original versions. Personally I would rather have restored original parts than new parts that may fit but have lost much in the consolidation of part numbers the resultant loss of manufacturing to original specs.

    If any of you have knobs with good wood(the condition of plastic pieces do not matter at all), I need several to test with and photograph...we can work something out, PM me.
    Last edited by hls30.com; 10-14-2012 at 07:11 AM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    Does anyone know where we can get a emblem reproduced in the original "Cloisonne" technique?? I can reproduce the shift knob on a lathe. I made one for my Z out of Mesquite wood and used the original emblem. I suppose that once I got the process refined, I could make a few of them... just throwing it out there...
    Andrew (ZCurves)
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    Registered User psdenno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZCurves View Post
    Does anyone know where we can get a emblem reproduced in the original "Cloisonne" technique?? I can reproduce the shift knob on a lathe. I made one for my Z out of Mesquite wood and used the original emblem. I suppose that once I got the process refined, I could make a few of them... just throwing it out there...
    Having them made in cloisonné would be easy enough - just would have to go with a minimum quantity which could be a 200 year supply depending on demand.
    Dennis
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    The Reproduction on E-Bay has a Red "R" - the original I have use a White "R"

    FWIW,
    Carl B.

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    I would be down to buy one as a spare as well.
    '72 Fairlady 240Z-L - HS30-10052, Imported in 1973 from Yokota Airbase
    '70 240Z - HLS30-19927, History in SCCA CP & Trans-Am, ICSCC CIP, IMSA GTU
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    You can put out me down for one.

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    Dennis is right, it would take $300 to have 100 made at http://www.allaboutpins.com . I am going to get a quote and revisit this forum later, maybe 100 wouldn't be so bad...
    Andrew (ZCurves)
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    Registered User Persimmon240's Avatar
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    I'd be in for one or two of the shift maps also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZCurves View Post
    Dennis is right, it would take $300 to have 100 made at http://www.allaboutpins.com . I am going to get a quote and revisit this forum later, maybe 100 wouldn't be so bad...
    I think most people that want an original 5spd. shift knob - want an accurate reproduction of the original plastic shift map. The "Cloisonne" technique would not fill that bill.

    FWIW,
    Carl B.

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    Carl,
    I agree with you about the emblems and the preference of 5 speed emblem, I am working on both as original to the 240Z.

    On getting the the metal shift emblems made-I have some samples I could photograph/measure/loan if needed. The following is just a quick reference photo for what I have in metal.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Ps I didn't comment on the links to the ebay fodder because every Z deserves better than any of those...
    Last edited by hls30.com; 10-14-2012 at 07:10 AM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    I got to playing with the eBay picture of the 5 speed shift pattern and drew a pattern on top of the picture after compensating for the eBay picture angle and distortion by using sketchup and paintbush app, a lengthy procedure for me. The result is the attached printable 5 speed shift pattern. I set the pixels per inch at 559 to make the whole picture print 1 inch wide so it should print close to the correct size but if not adjust the pixels per inch. With a Mac the preview app will do this by clicking on the tools tab, then adjust size, then set the pixels per inch to a larger number to make the printed pattern smaller. I feel sure this is easy with Windows though I am ignorant of how to do that. If someone gives me the exact inches or mm size of the shift pattern from a real shift knob by measuring from the middle of the circle on one side to the middle of it on the other I will repost with the correct pixels per inch. I did have trouble finding an exact match for the font Datsun used so if someone knows what would be more accurate let me know.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    You do know that pattern was not offered on the Z as it was sold?

    Several sellers/vendors "conglomerate facts" to fit their parts-Using Nissan replacement parts that happen to fit, but were never actually used on the Z-and include verbage to make you think they were-usually they also include the model that the part actually came on and lump it with Z models to distort the actual truth of the ad, but add an element of truth as an out if called on the entire statement as a bold faced fabrication: It may well be true a particulate shift knob was original to a Nissan Sunny, but it is equally true that same knob was never original to a Z car.
    Several Ebay sellers/Vendors also play games using NOS and OEM. While a part may be both NOS and OEM, they may be neither relative to a Z. Despite the background in one of the linked vendor-offered ebay shift knobs, the part pictured was never a Z part though it might well be NOS and OEM to something other than a Z. Another ebay seller specializing in Z parts offers a NOS OEM Gas cap from a BMW as "a Must for your restoration" knowing his cap is NOT a Nissan/Datsun, let alone a Z part!

    Let an original Parts Catalog/microfiche be your guide-not a seller/vendor with more to gain from your buying in to their blurb. Sometimes a seller accepts verbage from a questionable vendor as fact and unknowingly perpetuated the misinformation. Vendors who really want to sell the right parts will always be either a Nissan Dealer, or list the complete, correct, and verifiable part number for what they are selling-but don't make the mistake of thinking just because they posted a part number-or partial part number it is the right one for the part they are selling.

    The patterns I pictured plus a 5 speed version with concentric circles are the only ones original to the 240Z 260Z and 280Z-though the concentric circle versions were also available in reverse painted plastic as well-the painted plastic variety are the ones I am working on.
    Last edited by hls30.com; 10-14-2012 at 06:57 PM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    I've got a black plastic (faux leather) five speed knob on my 77. I believe it's got the original shift pattern insert.

    Would a pic of that help in any way? Do you want a nice close up?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl Beck View Post
    I think most people that want an original 5spd. shift knob - want an accurate reproduction of the original plastic shift map. The "Cloisonne" technique would not fill that bill.
    Carl, the insert in the original plastic knob was produced using the Cloisonne technique, look at hls30.com's picture attachments. If I were going to have them made, they would have to be a match for the original. The actual knob material would be the sticking point - I went with wood because I thought it was a nicer touch. To each his own.
    Andrew (ZCurves)
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    hls30.com,
    Thank you for the great clarification. The 71 240Z I sold 27 years ago had a light color wood shift knob with a 4 spd pattern. I would like to put a similar wood shift knob in the 240Z I have now except it has a 5 speed and the 5 speed knobs are naugahyde/leather. Do you know Where can I see a picture of a knob with the 5 spd concentric circle pattern that was also available?

    Captain Obvious,
    I would enjoy seeing a closeup of the shift pattern you have, straight on if possible to minimize perspective distortion in case I have any luck making a drawing out of it. Do they change color with age so they were originally all red and have now a mottled two tones of red with a bright red and a duller red?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl Beck View Post
    The Reproduction on E-Bay has a Red "R" - the original I have use a White "R"
    Carl B.
    I just found that out myself. I was patterning mine from one like on e-Bay. Have to re-do the art...
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
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    A good quality heart walnut is just the ticket for the knob.A very dense close grain wood with nice figure. Turns well.
    I made one for my 240, but unfortunately without the shift pattern.

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    One point in this discussion that I think is being overlooked, is that there were a couple other variations to consider here.

    We are referring to 3 different transmissions. Two with 4 speeds, and one with 5 speeds.

    The transmissions called out for different shift knobs, pretty obvious no? But consider this:

    The 4 speed variation:
    While the 4 SPD WOOD shift knob was the same for either the A or the B 4 speed transmission, there were THREE different part numbers. Difference unknown.

    The 4 SPD NON-WOOD knob (presumably plastic, the microfiche does not mention material) had a different one for the A transmission and TWO different ones for the B.

    That's 6 different part numbers for 2 transmissions of the same ... 4 speed... type.

    The 5 speed showed TWO completely different P/Ns but doesn't mention material, so presumably plastic.

    Aside from the # of speeds, are we even talking about the same insert? Can we verify that the one in the wood is the same as the one in the vinyl, (or was that an aftermarket one?).

    Just food for thought...
    E

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    Here is the knob I was referring to, it was off of a 75 Fairlady Z. Looks just like the wood USDM 4 speed that came on the 240z, but with a 5th speed on it. I believe the seller is on this site, but this is the only picture I have that the seller sent me of the knob before it broke. I have a friend that has a nice one I will see if he can post it later.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    -Michael

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikes Z car View Post
    I would enjoy seeing a closeup of the shift pattern you have, straight on if possible to minimize perspective distortion in case I have any luck making a drawing out of it. Do they change color with age so they were originally all red and have now a mottled two tones of red with a bright red and a duller red?
    Mike, I'll take a quality pic and post it here. I'm not sure about your color questions as this is the only knob I've had that has a shift pattern on it.

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    Id be down for a 5 speed wood shift knob. I was going to buy that shift knob on ebay. It comes from japan too, It wasn't on ebay for the longest time and when I emailed the guy he put it back up on ebay... still haven't bought it yet though because i find it hard to spend 200 bucks on a shift knob... :/
    1970 Datsun 240Z "Delilah" HLS3000979

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    Here is a picture of OEM 5 speed shifter knob from european 240Z. Hope this helps.Click image for larger version. 

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    -72 240Z "Goldie"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikes Z car View Post
    hls30.com,
    Thank you for the great clarification. The 71 240Z I sold 27 years ago had a light color wood shift knob with a 4 spd pattern. I would like to put a similar wood shift knob in the 240Z I have now except it has a 5 speed and the 5 speed knobs are naugahyde/leather. Do you know Where can I see a picture of a knob ...
    I am not sure of what knob you want a picture of. The picture I posted above show the oem 280Z 4 and five speed knobs with metal emblems-the actual knobs are cast plastic with a metal threaded insert, the 240Z Knobs are wood-I have never explored the genus or species- but the wood and turning is the same between the four and the five speed. The Four speed does have a bolder font/pattern than the five speed variety. Here is a picture of all of them-the picture is dark, From the side they are much lighter in color-almost a honey color(more tan than yellow) when new.
    There is one of the new Nissan replacement parts in the picture-the large diameter knob with the unscathed 4 speed emblem.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    hls30.com,
    Sorry I wasn't trying to be confusing I didn't realize there were so many different shift knobs for a Z! Thanks much for the pictures.

    Koalia,
    Thanks for the picture. That is the shift knob I would like to put in my car unless there is a 5 spd wood shift knob that was ever put in a 240Z in the U.S.
    Mike
    Last edited by Mikes Z car; 10-16-2012 at 07:00 AM.

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    Here's some good shots of my 5 speed shift pattern emblem. I've got the black plastic faux leather knob with the red insert:



    Insert popped out of the knob:


    Shot through an eye loupe trying to get as close as possible:


    If there's any other shots that might help, let me know and I'll try to do what I can.

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    Captain Obvious,
    Wow, thanks for the nice closeup! Can you give me the measurement of from the outside edge of the ring to the outside of the ring on the opposite side of the ring, at its outside edge as well? (I sure can be a pest huh!) If anyone has tips on making a picture into a printable graphic I would appreciate it. I understand Kinko's will print on plastic, maybe the colors come out better if they do the printing.
    Mike
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Does this answer your questions about sizing? I was going to post this one at first too, but I was worried that I was hogging too much bandwidth.

    The scale is in hundredths. In other words, each of the smallest divisions is .010 inches:


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    Captain Obvious,
    That is perfect. I also am worried I am taking too much bandwidth.
    Mike

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    Here's a quick pic of the preliminary art I created. I need to work a bit more on the font.
    It prins a lot better than it looks in the pic...
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Julio
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    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Datsun-Z-240...b72e54&vxp=mtr
    Quote Originally Posted by Decoy12 View Post
    I was wondering if anyone knows of anyone that reproduces the JDM 5 speed wooden shift knobs. I had a JDM one accidentally fall and the plastic lense/gear map shattered I was hoping that someone made a repro I could buy?

    HERE....................FWIW ,,, not 200$ not 150$ not even 50$ ,,,,,,,,,,,39$ in your car same week
    Last edited by 72 OJ; 10-18-2012 at 07:47 PM.

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    Known Zitus carrier! hls30.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 72 OJ View Post
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Datsun-Z-240...b72e54&vxp=mtr

    HERE....................FWIW ,,, not 200$ not 150$ not even 50$ ,,,,,,,,,,,39$ in your car same week
    And, Most Importantly, NOT an ORIGINAL Z PART! Not in my Z ever!

    That ad is a great example of an one written to confuse the uninformed by a seller with has a long and documented history of changing his business/ebay name and playing with descriptions to make them ambiguous so as to muddy the truth they hold. That may well be a "NEW NOS" Datsun Shift knob, but it is not one that Nissan ever put in a Z!
    Last edited by hls30.com; 10-18-2012 at 09:00 PM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Decoy12 View Post
    Here is the knob I was referring to, it was off of a 75 Fairlady Z. Looks just like the wood USDM 4 speed that came on the 240z, but with a 5th speed on it. I believe the seller is on this site, but this is the only picture I have that the seller sent me of the knob before it broke. I have a friend that has a nice one I will see if he can post it later.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The Ebay knob is almost identical to the above as per the original OP.......... and 39$ , real wood, no delay plus a perfect fit , BTW the vendor has good feedback
    Last edited by 72 OJ; 10-18-2012 at 09:23 PM.

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    OJ, ..."Almost identical"...is that really the way you see these:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Two knobs, one is an OEM early S30 5speed knob that is in a bit better shape than the one the OP pictured, and the other is the aftermarket one in the ebay ad...These really look almost identical to you?

    Admittedly the ebay ad is described as a walnut, but can you make out any of the grain in that seriously painted up dark shiny black knob? Even in the OPs picture you can clearly see the grain of the wood. Then lets look at the underside engraved black and white painted OEM emblem vs the Enameled Black, black red and chrome one on the ebay ad...Really, almost Identical...
    I gotta say I don't consider them even close! I would never have considered an oem wood and embossed plastic clear, black, and white knob to be almost identical to that shiny "walnut" knob-devoid of any hint of grain with a metal chrome-plated knob highlighted with Black, Red.

    From many detailed things you have posted, I am very surprised that you would call these "almost identical".

    I would call them both 5 shift knobs with an 8mm threaded insert, but to my eye they are about as far apart as MG V8 and an LS1, You don't see those as identical do you?
    I see them as I see these shift knobs, similar but no where close to almost identical.

    BTW if a buyer didn't know it wasn't an original shift knob and they received a good looking new shift knob would they wait until they discovered that the Shift knob was not original to a Z to leave feedback? Good feedback does not necessarily mean a seller is honest, only that the buyer may not know better.
    Last edited by hls30.com; 10-18-2012 at 10:12 PM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    Almost is almost , the OP ask for help, so I clearly put FWIW on my response , no need to scream my GA Bulldog Fan. BTW the pictures are not at the same scale , that particular knob has the same size as the one that came from Nippon
    Last edited by 72 OJ; 10-18-2012 at 09:50 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 72 OJ View Post
    Almost is almost , the OP ask for help, so I clearly put FWIW on my response , no need to scream my GA Bulldog Fan
    Hold on~! Just because I live in Georgia and I have many pictures of a Red '73 with black interior does not mean I am automatically a Georgia Fan. I know far more about these shift knobs than I do about Georgia Football-I know more about UGA the bulldog than I know about Georgia Football-though I do know the Jekyll Island Club is hosting a dinner with Vince Dooley this weekend-you see Ga/FL weekend interferes with celebrating my wedding anniversary in the way that I would like!
    Last edited by hls30.com; 10-18-2012 at 10:12 PM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    That is Vincent Joseph Dooley..................

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    OJ,
    From witnessing the BS Datsun Parts sells and has sold, I would never buy from him ever. He is full of it even with a 99% feed back
    John Thomas Bertrand
    Model: HLS30 STD CPE 2DR
    Color: 305 LIGHT BLUE
    Serial: HLS30-298085
    Engine: L28-081399
    Port of Entry: 34 JACKSONVILLE
    Method of Transport: TRUCK
    Dealer to whom delivered:
    Brown Datsun INC
    213 E Liberty ST
    Lyons, GA 30436


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    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	$T2eC16VHJHoE9n3Ke5,CBQ,9O-F7Kg~~60_57.jpg 
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ID:	57284 I got this one for my old Z and it was very nice

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    Quote Originally Posted by hls30.com View Post
    OJ, ..."Almost identical"...is that really the way you see these:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Two knobs, one is an OEM early S30 5speed knob that is in a bit better shape than the one the OP pictured, and the other is the aftermarket one in the ebay ad...These really look almost identical to you?
    Exactly what I was referring to, I want to replace the one that broke! I actually own this knob:

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Datsun-240z-...2e9474&vxp=mtr

    ...but the wood one was so much better! I looked for a long time for that JDM knob and was a bummer seeing it break.

    Not to deviate from the topic, but 280~Master is also correct, my friend bought a "rebuilt" engine... looked good on the outside, but was dirty on the inside when they pulled it apart. Even though his store is in the next town over, I would steer clear as well.
    -Michael

    HLS30-58745

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    Datsun-Parts is a known problem vendor. This last ID, "DATSUN-PARTS" is the longest standing ID he has ever had.

    Here is his ID history:

    User ID-------------------Effective Date------------End Date
    datsun-parts................May-01-07...................Present
    ur-gelis.......................Oct-21-04....................May-01-07
    bad-mfr .....................May-12-03....................Oct-21-04
    absolutely-ghetto.........Mar-03-03....................May-12-03
    2602nv.......................Mar-20-02....................Mar-03-03

    Those of us who have followed his history, recall when his reputation was poor, reliability was questionable, and many people had valid complaints that weren't satisfied or addressed.

    While he may have turned over a new leaf and is maybe now a valid vendor, he still has a lot of baggage with a lot of members to overcome.

    Do a search for ur-gelis and you'll find a LOT of disatisfied clients just amongst the membership here. The previous names also had additional bad history.

    He racks up "good" feedback from newbies who don't know from whom to buy, and WHAT to buy, and only later discover they were hood-winked. Sadly those noobies often continue to think it was their fault and not the vendors.

    If you look at the shift knob offered, as it has been pointed out, you can see that it is NOT "almost identical".
    If it were, the OP would have jumped on that one some time ago.

    One person's "equal" is another's "not-even-close", which is where this club is so helpful at finding the CORRECT answers.

    FWIW
    E

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    I really wish I still had access to a 3D printer. Makes things soo much easier! After looking at the better pics, I need to revise my artwork a bit more. Hope to have a new prototype made in two weeks.
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
    CZC# 15388

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    So is my black plastic faux leather knob and insert factory for 77? When I got the car, the insert was already loose. It stays in by itself simply with friction, but it's not glued.

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    I wonder if you're better off buying one of the repop fat 5-speed knobs and lathing it down? The shift map is not identical to the original style, but it might still provide decent results.

    Anyways, I sympathize with your plight. I managed to find a good used 5-speed thin knob in Japan for a cool $150, but I'm also in need of another, so if anything comes to fruition, I'd be interested in one.

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    I finally noticed the 5 SPD Euro knob appears to have a drop shadow around the numbers and everything else. The black and white pattern attached here will print to the correct size. To adjust the size of either change the pixels per inch.

    Name:  Euro 5 SPD 30mm size final.jpg
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    Pet Peeve: There is nothing "euro" about the Datsun / Nissan / Fairlady / S30 / 240-60-80 Z! It's a Japanese car.

    So that's ur-gelis, huh? Ha-ha, 72OJ, if it feels good in your hand...

    Georgia Bulldogs have a lot of bark, a mean bark, but Gators bite!
    Enjoy the Ride
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    Go Gators
    Go Butler Bulldogs

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    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	57305 This is the proper shift knob for a Japanese Classic Sport Motor Car

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    Quote Originally Posted by 72 OJ View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DSC00693.jpg 
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ID:	57305 This is the proper shift knob for a Japanese Classic Sport Motor Car
    In your opinion, perhaps. I most certainly do not agree. Too modern, not "Classic" at all.

    But that is just my opinion, and others are free to do as they wish.
    Arne - Former owner, HLS30-37705, 7/71, 905 Red
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    Well I respect your personal opinion , the original knob/stick and steering wheel replacements are very popular mods from day one, I never liked the truck like stick shift( sits to high ) or the skinny steering wheel ( no grip ) we do to them what we like Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by 72 OJ; 10-20-2012 at 10:30 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikes Z car View Post
    I finally noticed the 5 SPD Euro knob appears to have a drop shadow around the numbers and everything else.Name:  Euro 5 SPD 30mm size final.jpg
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    That's part of what I'm doing to my art. I'll try using your template, as the scale relative scale and font are correct. Thanks for posting this.
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
    CZC# 15388

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    Oiluj,
    You are welcome for the post. If you can figure out how to put those drop shadows on a shift pattern I will stand up and salute you smartly!
    Mike

    Here is what it looks like on a shift knob that I got yesterday that needs sanding and re-varnishing:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Mike, What are "drop shadows"?

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    Captain Obvious,
    I am not sure I am using the correct terminology but if you look at the black and white shift knob picture in Koalia's post (post #30 in this thread) there are slightly darker "shadows" that outline the numbers and other markings on that shift knob if I am seeing them correctly. Some fonts come that way though I could not find anything on the net that looked remotely correct for Koalia's shift knob. Wish I knew more about resolution but I think to get those shadows on the shift map artwork I posted a higher resolution is needed, anyone know more about this?
    Mike
    Last edited by Mikes Z car; 10-20-2012 at 03:56 PM. Reason: Correct Koalia's post number

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    Mike,

    My current art includes a grey drop shadow, but the fony isn't quite right and proportions of the font & shift pattern needs to be adusted. Using yours, I should be able to make it pertty close.
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
    CZC# 15388

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    That "drop shadow" is going to be extremely difficult to reproduce in a 2d B/W print.

    Isn't the shadow a result of the MOLDED numbers and pattern?

    See the following pictures:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    71 240 920 Gold
    72 240 Orange
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    67 1600 Sports Roadster Spicy Orange Mica
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    Yes, it will not be possible to get 2D drop-shadows to perfectly mimic a 3D feature. My existing art does a pretty good job of reproducing it around the letters, but suprisingly, the circles and shift pattern are actually more difficult.
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
    CZC# 15388

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikes Z car View Post
    there are slightly darker "shadows" that outline the numbers
    Mike, Thanks, I got it now.

    EScanlon is right in that it is caused by the fact that the numbers and shift pattern are molded and have height to them.

    Those shadows are actually white paint on the sloped sides of the raised numbers and lines. From looking at the pics that EScanlon posted, it appears to me that they molded (or maybe vacuum formed) the black part out of black plastic and then painted all the white features on by hand. Then they potted the top part in a clear material.

    I wasn't there when they made that thing, but here's what I see happening...
    First they mold the black plastic disk.
    Then they fill (inlay sorta) the outer two rings with white paint and wipe or buff off the excess resulting in a quality edge.
    Then they paint the raised letters.
    Then they mold the top dome in a clear acrylic or epoxy.

    All for about $1.29

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    Actually, I believe the entire disk was molded in clear, with the letters and pattern in relief. The characters, rings and pattern are hand painted white and buffed off as noted, and then the entire underside is painted black. Simple and with a minimum of separate steps.
    Last edited by Arne; 10-20-2012 at 07:25 PM.
    Arne - Former owner, HLS30-37705, 7/71, 905 Red
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    I think Arne is spot on.

    That's the same method we use when we paint R/C car bodies or even the HO Scale Lexan bodies that I've painted.

    E

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arne View Post
    Actually, I believe the entire disk was molded in clear, with the letters and pattern in relief. The characters, rings and pattern are hand painted white and buffed off as noted, and then the entire underside is painted black. Simple and with a minimum of separate steps.
    And that's why I miss not having access anymore to a 3D printer!
    Julio
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    Gotcha. I'll go along with that. They could do that for even less than $1.29!!

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    Thanks EScanlon for posting the pictures. I can see the relief in the plastic making the drop shadows. Hmm.. Wonder if a mold could be made from one. The 5 SPD map is so rare I gather that one wouldn't want to risk destroying a map trying to copy it though.

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    Default Stock 280 4 speed pattern.

    I am looking for the original green 76 - 280 4 speed pattern like the one pictured. I know it's different that the ones already shown, still looking though.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Michael 11/75 - 76-280 - HLS30-281,114
    Web site -Click Here and ORIGINAL OWNERS OF THE 280Z (1975-1976 -1977 - 1978 - ONLY) REGISTRATION[

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    mgood,
    I don't know if this is worth mentioning. I saw a green 4 spd shift pattern, just the pattern itself no knob, in a box of shift knobs/parts last weekend at :
    Datsun Z Doctor
    504 E 43rd St Ste A, Boise, ID 83714
    phone 208-376-8727
    Can't vouch entirely for the condition as I was looking for a B&W 5 spd pattern and wasn't paying that much attention. I don't imagine it will sell soon. Make him an offer and see if he will sell it? He has worked on my car a few times.
    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by mgood View Post
    I am looking for the original green 76 - 280 4 speed pattern like the one pictured. I know it's different that the ones already shown, still looking though.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    You may also try finding a black one and repainting it.

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    Koalia,
    Would you post a few more pictures of your 5 spd shift knob as in your post #30 but straight on to the knob instead of at a slight angle? The distance from the shift knob in post #30 I think is good to make an artwork that might have shadows though a straight on picture should make the "shadows" show up balanced.
    Thanks,
    Mike

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    Hi all,

    I just stumbled onto this post in my search for a genuine(-ish?) gear knob.

    Having been through all the options mentioned in this post. I had already planned to make one too.

    I thought I would offer my suggestion to this post for your opinions.

    I intend to buy a genuine genuine 4 speed knob and fit a reproduction pattern badge to it.

    My idea for the badge is to use a piece of clear plastic and engrave it on a CNC router (I have ordered a Chinese made one for other purposes). This would allow an accurate reproduction of the raised letters and shapes.

    I would then paint it as shown in my diagram below.

    To finish it off I would attach a clear dome or watch crystal.

    A quick search on eBay shows lots of inexpensive watch glass and acrylic domes.
    (eg. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/LOW-DOME-...#ht_2633wt_906)

    Like Mike, I would also like to see some more pictures of Koalia's knob.

    Hopefully one of us will get this right and we can all get a good result.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	5 speed pattern Diagrams.jpg 
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    Cheers
    Ian

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    If you have a CNC router - you would just start with a thick piece of clear acrylic - cut the pattern in the bottom - and cut/form the dome on the top.

    FWIW,
    Carl B.

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    GongZ,
    Here is a snapshot of the eBay listing for the acrylic watch dome to make this thread longer lasting. Great idea on using a router! Nice graphic showing the process of making a map.
    Mike

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Mikes Z car; 10-27-2012 at 07:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GongZ View Post
    Hi all,


    My idea for the badge is to use a piece of clear plastic and engrave it on a CNC router (I have ordered a Chinese made one for other purposes). This would allow an accurate reproduction of the raised letters and shapes.


    Cheers
    Ian
    This has been my plan from day1-just as Carl said-cut from one thick piece of Acrylic-just waiting on tiny(I mean seriously small-I believe they are being made specifically for me) router bits to make the corners of the numbers sharp instead of rounded. I want it to look exactly right, not "good enough".

    If that does not work, I will use my cnc milling machine to mill a mold in some fortal, and cast them.

    Pocket cutting always gives the inside "corners" of the pockets the radius of the tool used to cut the pocket-instead of a sharp corner-doing the final cuts with a fine diameter tool will lower that radius-hopefully to unnoticeable, but fine milling plastic with such a small bit may not give acceptable results-even with good sized bits plastic likes to melt/burn with high speed tools.

    In the alternate method I can get as sharp an edge as I want on a corner, while it will still be pocket cutting, the areas that need to be sharp have room for crossing cuts to produce sharp(er) edges.


    FWIW
    Will
    Last edited by hls30.com; 11-05-2012 at 06:32 AM.
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ID:	57627I purchased one of those fat shiny knobs but it just doesn't feel good in my hand and when I saw this thread I got an idea.
    Found an old metric bolt that fit it, cut off the head mounted it in the drill press. Using a coarse file and 4 different grades of sand paper brought it down to this, not really original looking but much more comfortable and I can see and feel the wood grain now.
    1970 240Z HLS30 01955 March/70

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    Nice job..... and with primitive tools!
    Dennis
    1971 240Z - Original Owner
    2010 Infiniti G37 Convertible

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    HS130-150591 4/79 zbane's Avatar
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    I wonder if it'd be simpler/better to have the shift map stamped in metal. No worries about it breaking, could be painted to owner's taste, and topped with the watch bevel or a clear filler.
    http://www.universalmarking.com/dies.html
    http://www.pryormarking.com/marking-...sing-dies.html
    David
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    2001 Infiniti I 30

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    Question Dimensions of the timber/wood part of the original shift knob

    Hi again all,

    Firstly, I take all of your points WIll. I have only just received my (faulty so far) CNC machine, so I have nil experience with milling plastics .

    I look forward to hearing how your experiments proceed.

    On a related issue;

    Does anyone have an original 'skinny' 4 or 5 speed knob and an accurate way of measuring the wood section?

    I bought a new "Genuine Nissan" 4 speed shift knob and I would like to either reshape this knob (using grannyknot's clever drill press approach) or make a new wood section.

    This diagram shows what I (and others I assume) would like to have measurements for.



    Click image for larger version. 

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    I hope someone can help out.

    Cheers
    Ian

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    Quote Originally Posted by GongZ View Post
    Hi again all,

    Firstly, I take all of your points WIll. I have only just received my (faulty so far) CNC machine, so I have nil experience with milling plastics .

    I look forward to hearing how your experiments proceed.

    On a related issue;

    Does anyone have an original 'skinny' 4 or 5 speed knob and an accurate way of measuring the wood section?

    I bought a new "Genuine Nissan" 4 speed shift knob and I would like to either reshape this knob (using grannyknot's clever drill press approach) or make a new wood section.

    This diagram shows what I (and others I assume) would like to have measurements for.



    Click image for larger version. 

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    I hope someone can help out.

    Cheers
    Ian
    Ian-G'day Mate!
    If no one beats me to it I'll measure and post all of it later today. I moved my Mill/Drill/Lathe last weekend, and still have a healthy amount of putting it back together and recalibrating to do to bring it operational-and with the heart of the holidays here, I don't know how much time I'll have to put into this over the next 35 days. I have had several knobs disassembled waiting for me to get time-it looks like I am still time challenged-so I will take the measurements and post them for you.
    My intention was to restore used, original knobs by replacing /refinishing what needed it, and keeping what didn't-a properly restored piece is more valuable to me than an all new reproduction.
    I don't think making everything new represents any challenge-other than actually matching the original wood species.
    I planned to have two sift knobs for my Z-one restored original, and one original knob resto-modded with the metal emblem from a later knob.
    Will
    Last edited by hls30.com; 11-30-2012 at 07:07 AM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    I found my original notes on this!
    There is a little variation between the three examples I originally measured, but middle measurements are:
    W1 1.510"
    W2 1.095"
    W3 1.061"
    H1 1.755"
    H2 1.225"

    I measured the insert as well if you need it.
    Will
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    Quote Originally Posted by hls30.com View Post
    and one original knob resto-modded with the metal emblem from a later knob.
    That's pretty much what I ended up with. One thing to watch for is that the metal cloisonné style maps are a little smaller in diameter than the plastic ones. That's the reason for the flat ring at the top of my knob. I modeled my wood just like the original wood knobs, but with the shift map smaller, you end up with a narrow flat. If the map were slightly larger in diameter, then the flat width would be reduced:



    It doesn't bother me and I didn't even realize it until I went back through this thread and looked at the other five speed knobs.

    The point is, that if you're trying to put the cloisonné map into an older knob, you'll have to deal with the moat around the edge where the new map rattles around in the larger opening.

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    That looks just about like I envisioned it-Sharp! My plan for the space between the 5 speed metal emblem and the existing opening was to machine a stepped ring to fill the space with-and to give the emblem a concentric circle similar to the one the plastic emblem and the metal 4 speed emblem have-I also considered removing the glass, and filling the recessed area of the emblem with body color matched paint.
    Last edited by hls30.com; 11-30-2012 at 09:06 PM.
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    My original 73 4 speed knob measures in mm's:

    W1 = 40mm
    W2 = 27mm
    W3 = 26mm
    H1 = 30mm
    H2 = 44mm

    All measurements appear to be spot on in this form of measurement, ie no fractions of a mm.

    Bonzi Lon
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    Smile

    Thanks for the measurements gentlemen!

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    Here are some pictures for the original green 4 speed knob. I know it's not the 5 speed but this could help those that want original 4 speed knobs.
    The picture of my original that came with my car 11/75 - 76 280, a picture of the new (looks never used) insert I purchased on Ebay last week. I also made a drawing from the new one. Hope this helps someone.

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    Michael 11/75 - 76-280 - HLS30-281,114
    Web site -Click Here and ORIGINAL OWNERS OF THE 280Z (1975-1976 -1977 - 1978 - ONLY) REGISTRATION[

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    Great thread. Sure beats buying that one on ebay for $200. So which one of you is going to start selling these bad boys first?
    Decoy12 likes this.
    Feb '70 & Mar '71 240z

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    Quote Originally Posted by Decoy12 View Post
    Here is the knob I was referring to, it was off of a 75 Fairlady Z. Looks just like the wood USDM 4 speed that came on the 240z, but with a 5th speed on it. I believe the seller is on this site, but this is the only picture I have that the seller sent me of the knob before it broke. I have a friend that has a nice one I will see if he can post it later.

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    I have three of these knobs. They came with the Aussie cars which all had 5 speeds. You may want to ask around here. I bought the last one for $15. Happy to post detailed pics if wanted.

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    How is the idea coming with the knob reproduction?
    1970 Datsun 240Z "Delilah" HLS3000979

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    Jerry Purcell
    1970 HLS30 00029 Owner since 1976 Now owned by Les Canaday (Classic Datsun Motorsports)
    1972 HLS30 93606 IZCC Registion #105 Original owner back home after full restoration by Classic Datsun Motorsports

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    I wonder how many of those $200 5spd shift knobs they sell each year? It is pricing like that keeps people away from these cars along with the fact that many of the parts owners really need are no longer made. Absolutely disappointing! GM and Ford support almost all of their classic cars either by still offering many parts at dealerships or allowing companies to re-produce parts. Nissan needs to get it over itself and either truly support their classic cars with in stock parts at reasonable prices or let other companies do it for them like MSA, Classic Datsun, and the like.
    08/1970 240z Series-1 #8011 - Silver, black int., 2.4L I-6, 5spd, 90% restored.
    06/1973 VW Karmann Ghia - Black convertible, 4spd, 1600cc air-cooled engine.
    11/2013 Scion FR-S - Silver, 6spd, a car with the soul of a Z for the modern times.
    Restoration thread of my old '72 240z -> http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/o...1972-240z.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardway View Post
    I wonder how many of those $200 5spd shift knobs they sell each year? It is pricing like that keeps people away from these cars along with the fact that many of the parts owners really need are no longer made. Absolutely disappointing! GM and Ford support almost all of their classic cars either by still offering many parts at dealerships or allowing companies to re-produce parts. Nissan needs to get it over itself and either truly support their classic cars with in stock parts at reasonable prices or let other companies do it for them like MSA, Classic Datsun, and the like.
    Get over itself? The thing is, Nissan doesn't need to do anything. Are you suggesting Nissan tools up for tiny production runs of parts for cars they made 40 years ago? That's never going to happen.

    It's all about the market. Compare the production numbers of Mustangs to the S30 and you'll have the answer of why they're better supported.

    With that said, there are reproductions being made for plenty of Z parts, just look at MSA's site. I don't think Nissan is stopping anyone. I also don't think a $200 shift knob on ebay keeps people away from these cars. Frankly, the cheap price of entry into the Z-world reflects the opposite and thus the Z populace generally seems notoriously cheap (compared to other vintage car owners).

    I wouldn't mind prices of Z parts going up at all, it'll make my hoard more valuable.
    2/74 260Z

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardway View Post
    I wonder how many of those $200 5spd shift knobs they sell each year? It is pricing like that keeps people away from these cars along with the fact that many of the parts owners really need are no longer made. Absolutely disappointing! GM and Ford support almost all of their classic cars either by still offering many parts at dealerships or allowing companies to re-produce parts. Nissan needs to get it over itself and either truly support their classic cars with in stock parts at reasonable prices or let other companies do it for them like MSA, Classic Datsun, and the like.
    The biggest issue with that knob for me is that it although it may be Nissan, it is clearly not a period knob - the original knobs were much narrower. A period knob recently went for $400 on Yahoo Japan.

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    Anyone have an update? I mailed the remains of my 5 speed to one of the members here soon after I started this thread with promises of close to finishing the final product/restoring my own and using it to display the reproduction, but I have not heard back or had my last 2 PMs replied to since. Any luck OILUJ?
    Last edited by Decoy12; 01-30-2014 at 12:01 AM.
    -Michael

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    Made two more attempts at reproducing a decent insert that failed.
    I'm working on getting access to another 3D printer to make a "positive" from polyurethane, from which I could make a soft silicone mold.
    I looked into having a custom prototyping shop print one, but the cost was prohibitive.
    Decoy12 likes this.
    Julio
    1972 240Z (in-progress, 95% complete)
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    Was this made by anyone here? I ran into this ebay auction by chance... Wish there were more pictures. I haven't pulled the trigger... yet.
    Datsun 240Z 260z 280z Reproduction Shift Knob 5 Speed Walnut | eBay

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    -Michael

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeonV View Post
    Get over itself? The thing is, Nissan doesn't need to do anything. Are you suggesting Nissan tools up for tiny production runs of parts for cars they made 40 years ago? That's never going to happen.

    It's all about the market. Compare the production numbers of Mustangs to the S30 and you'll have the answer of why they're better supported.

    With that said, there are reproductions being made for plenty of Z parts, just look at MSA's site. I don't think Nissan is stopping anyone. I also don't think a $200 shift knob on ebay keeps people away from these cars. Frankly, the cheap price of entry into the Z-world reflects the opposite and thus the Z populace generally seems notoriously cheap (compared to other vintage car owners).

    I wouldn't mind prices of Z parts going up at all, it'll make my hoard more valuable.
    I wouldn't mind prices going up to...
    HLS30 32581, 5/71 Matching numbers

    Jay Leno : You know one week after the Americans have walked on the moon, the Japanese introduced this sports car, and…if you’re a car guy pretty equal. I mean walking on the moon was pretty good, but how many times you’d gonna walk on the moon? But here was an affordable sports car that had real performance and looked like it cost a lot more than it did.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Decoy12 View Post
    Was this made by anyone here? I ran into this ebay auction by chance... Wish there were more pictures. I haven't pulled the trigger... yet.
    Datsun 240Z 260z 280z Reproduction Shift Knob 5 Speed Walnut | eBay

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    I've seen that and whilst it's would pass as original to most, I feel it's not quite there. The lower metal pice at the base of it isn't the same size or shape. The thickness of it is different to the original. So really the only thing it has in common with an OEM 1 is the 5 speed button design.

    Price wise though it's very reasonable.

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