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Thread: Stock cam choice?

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    Semi-retired admin Arne's Avatar
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    Default Stock cam choice?

    So here is a not so hypothetical question - assume that you are building a mostly stock L24 with a small valve E88 head. You have two cams to choose from, an internally oiled late L28 cam, or an externally oiled L24 cam. Which do you go with, assuming everything else is the same? Is internally oiled enough better to use that one rather than the possibly better cam timing of the early cam?
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    The external oiling system is superior in regards to lubrication when everything is functioning as it should, but either works fine unless you're really really pushing it. If one has a cam timing advantage I'd definitely go for that one. With stock I would think the one that is more retarded would be the one to have. The spray bar is more prone to trouble though, like the soldered joints in the bar coming loose.

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    I guess that's the nub of it, does anyone know what the timing differences (if any) are between the stock L24 cam (marked E30, as I recall) and one from an '83 NA 280ZX L28?

    I've got two good cams to choose from, the one in the E88 that I'm going to use, and one in a P79. Both cams are in good shape, and I have all the matching rocker arms for both. If I go with the L24 cam, I'll replace the spray bar, even though the one on the head looks OK.
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    Here you go: http://www.atlanticz.ca/zclub/techtips/cam/index.htm

    Looks like the early cam is ever so slighty more aggressive.

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    Perfect, Jon! That's exactly the data I was looking for.

    Looks like the L26 cam was maybe even a touch hotter yet. But of the two I have the early cam would appear to be the better choice.
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    beandip beandip's Avatar
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    The cam from a L-26 I am told has the tallest lift of the all the nissan cams.
    I'd rather die while I am living than live while I am dieing. CZC 1887 IZCC 12602 Member of NorthWest Z Car Club

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    If the chart linked above is correct, the stock L24 cam has more lift on the intake valve than any other stock cam. But the L26 cam has longer duration and more overlap.

    That said, it doesn't appear to me that there is a heck of a lot of difference between any of the stock cams.
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    You're right Arne they're all pretty much the same. Even a stock engine can do a little better and make a bit more power with a bigger cam IME.

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    Agreed, and I may go to a little hotter cam at some point. But if I can use one of the existing cam/rocker arm sets that I already have, that saves cash for other needed things. My first goal is to get my car back on the road, then I can worry about making it faster.
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    Arne: I just did the 4th cam change in my '71 240Z. I went with a .450-lift solid w/hydraulic lifters, (did not work at all) I then installed a turbo hydraulic cam w/hydraulic lifters, (worked great but ran out of steam at 5500) installed a Gude .480 lift hydraulic cam w/hydraulic lifters, (did not work/pumped up the lifters) and finally, I have installed the .450 solid WEB Cam w/solid lifter conversions. It will run the first time tomorrow. I simply gave up on the hydraulic lifters. Steve Epperly modified one lifter. Put the solid adjuster into the hydraulic base. It works! I took the rest of the parts to a buddy of mine and he did the machine work. I now have 12 solid/hydraulic hybrid ifters that will screw into the P90A head. I now can adjust my valves just like the P90 head. Hurray! I can hardly wait to get this thing running. By the way... Bill Gude is going to take the hydraulic cam back and replace it with a solid camshaft. I may change to that cam once I get the car running. I have driven the car 150 miles. It isn't even broken in!
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    philo "Z" opher Zedrally's Avatar
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    Can you explain the advantage in having hydraulic lifters in a early L series engine?
    I don't understand solid/hydraulic hybrid, surely they either are one or the other?
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmortensen
    Here you go: http://www.atlanticz.ca/zclub/techtips/cam/index.htm

    Looks like the early cam is ever so slighty more aggressive.
    Thanks for that resource I'm sure it will be very useful to many people.

    FWIW I went with a schneider 300F cam with all new rockers, springs, lashpads, and retainers. I can't wait to try it out with the triple 44 Mikuni's I purchased.

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    Nissan build a hydraulic engine/head (P90A) for the 1984 (?) Turbo. I bought this head from a guy that wanted a "trouble free" engine built with a hydraulic head. His theory was no valve adjustment. He also wanted a quiet-running engine. Someone told him to run a mild solid cam in this hydraulic head. I do not care what anyone says, THIS DOES NOT WORK! I have given up on this hydraulic head and made solid adjusters for the head.

    To fully answer your question, ALL Datsuns had solid adjusters except for the 1984 Turbo. (And some of them were not hydraulic, so I am told) Some P90A heads came with solid adjusters from the factory. Who knows why!
    Last edited by ZSaint; 03-08-2006 at 05:59 PM.
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    I hope you have a supply of emulsion tubes, air correction jets and main jets. Your can will run like crap until you get the correct set-up. Once you get the carbs set, look out! This set-up really pumps some air/fuel mixture into your engine. Check it out with others. List what you have in your engine. Someone who has a similar engine can give you the jetting for your carbs. Good luck and stand on the loud pedal!
    Z Saint, the vintage racer! I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved.

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    Mikunis are pretty easy, and everyone seems to run the OA jet block / emulsion tube, so that variable is pretty much removed from the tuning equation. So really you have pilots (VERY important), mains, airs, and last the pump nozzles (not nearly as important) and that's it. Get an O2 sensor in the exhaust, then you'll know for sure instead of trying to read the plugs or smell the exhaust. I used a narrowband one wire O2 sensor and read it with a $6 Harbor Freight voltmeter.

    The Japanese P90a came with solid lifters. There is another way to convert them to manual adjustment, which I haven't done, but it sounds REALLY easy. You pull out the posts on the hydraulic head first. Now the normal ones don't fit, because the hydraulic head's posts are a different larger thread pitch. Someone on hybridz.org figured out that there is a helicoil that threads into the P90a head that fits the regular manual adjust posts. So that's all you need to do. Not sure if the rockers are the same, and you'd need some lash pads I'm sure, but the rest is just bolt in with those helicoils.

    Sorry Arne for jacking your thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmortensen
    Sorry Arne for jacking your thread.
    Like I care? Not even. I learn lots from this type of give and take.
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    I called two manufacturers of heli-coils. They do not have the size we need. If someone can give me a "NUMBER for this heli-coil, I would appreciate it. No one seems to be able to do this. I am certain that people would be selling these helicoils on eBay if they were available. Where and what are they? Number? Manufacturer?
    Z Saint, the vintage racer! I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved.

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    Like I said, I haven't done it myself, but this thread has a part number. BTW, its a Timesert, not a helicoil. Same thing, different manufacturer I guess.

    http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=105025

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    PaperBoy Go240Zags's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZSaint
    Nissan build a hydraulic engine/head (P90A) for the 1984 (?) Turbo. I bought this head from a guy that wanted a "trouble free" engine built with a hydraulic head. His theory was no valve adjustment. He also wanted a quiet-running engine. Someone told him to run a mild solid cam in this hydraulic head. I do not care what anyone says, THIS DOES NOT WORK! I have given up on this hydraulic head and made solid adjusters for the head.

    To fully answer your question, ALL Datsuns had solid adjusters except for the 1984 Turbo. (And some of them were not hydraulic, so I am told) Some P90A heads came with solid adjusters from the factory. Who knows why!
    That's the 1983 280ZX (not 1984) Turbo with the P90A Hydrolic Lifter head, have one out in my backyard under cover as we speak. I went and bought a solid lifter P90 that I'm having worked on right now, the P90A and engine are for future use (spares) or to sell some day.
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    Hey, I am old and dates mean nothing to us old guys! I figured it out after I sent the message that is why I put the (?) behind the year, got it? I have the poster in my garage. Why can't I remember these dates? 'Cause I'm old!

    I went to both Helicoil and Timesert web pages. I could not find the size we need. I emailed them and called them. They told me this thread pattern we not available. (too large) I will pay anyone $20 if they give me a working number for this Timesert part. I will verify the number, of course. I know... "Here is the number, ZSaint. It is 12345XYZ. Pay me my money!"

    How about earning yourself $20? Get the number for these threads!
    Z Saint, the vintage racer! I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved.

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    I found the number in an old post I made. I bought a new computer in November and did not get the last of these posts. Here is the number:

    Zcar Link

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Verbiage: They're 1.5mm thread, as are the solid lifters. Hydro are 20 x 1.5 x 28 (total lifter length). Solid 18 x 1.5 x ~19mm.

    www.timesert.com

    The Timesert item number is 18153 (M18x1.5x18.3 INSERT)

    Time Fastener Co
    5301 Longley Lane
    Reno, NV 89511
    (775) 829-1026

    Alex

    I will pay myself $20 WHEN I GET THESE INSERTS FROM TIMESERT!
    Z Saint, the vintage racer! I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved.

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    Thumbs up Rigged Competition.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZSaint
    I found the number in an old post I made. I bought a new computer in November and did not get the last of these posts. Here is the number:

    Zcar Link

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Verbiage: They're 1.5mm thread, as are the solid lifters. Hydro are 20 x 1.5 x 28 (total lifter length). Solid 18 x 1.5 x ~19mm.

    www.timesert.com

    The Timesert item number is 18153 (M18x1.5x18.3 INSERT)

    Time Fastener Co
    5301 Longley Lane
    Reno, NV 89511
    (775) 829-1026

    Alex

    I will pay myself $20 WHEN I GET THESE INSERTS FROM TIMESERT!

    This competition was rigged.

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