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Thread: seat belts

  1. #1
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    Default seat belts

    Need some info on seatbelt options. I did some searching but didn't find much. The car is a 1972, will be a daily driver, auto-cross, some track days. What are options for seat belts for this year car? We would want at least a shoulder strap. I also looked at the Scroth web site and liked their stuff. I have been a passenger in a cobra mustang that used them and they worked very well. The problem is the stock Z seats, they don't have openings or a headrest that the Scroth set use. We are rebiulding the stock seats and doing our own upolstering. I thought about fabbing some holes during the rebiuld. Any info would be a great help.
    Thank you,
    Thomas

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    Default

    so does everyone keep their stock lap belts?

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    Registered User MikeW's Avatar
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    Default

    Sorry, I meant to reply earlier and forgot. As far as I know all 240Z's came with lap and shoulder belts. The earlier belts were adjustable but not retracting. Around 9/71 pockets were added to the floorboards behind the seats to accept a retracting spool for the lap portion only. These showed up later in the 1972 model year. My car came with the pockets but with rubber plugs in the extra bolt holes. Later models (260 or 280?) came with retracting shoulder belts as well and some people have retrofitted those to earlier cars.

    I don't know of anywhere to buy OEM seatbelts. Courtesy Nissan lists these:

    http://www.courtesyparts.com/Merchan...Code=H6830-S30

    but they don't look original to me and they appear to be out of stock anyhow.

    The only belts that MSA shows are those that you've already mentioned:

    http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/CTGY/PIC06

    Finally, one option is to get the original belts restored. I've heard that these people do good work but haven't used them:

    http://www.ssnake-oyl.com/
    -Mike
    Add your Z to my online spreadsheet registry

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    Z lover Pir0San's Avatar
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    Default

    my Z, manufactured 8/72, has both retracting lap and shoulder belts, if that helps.
    -Jeremy
    '72 Datsun 240Z

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    CDavid c david's Avatar
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    Default custom seat belt

    this is not much of a picture but i had mine made custom. they have spools at both anchor points and i used the coat hanger thread terminal to attach a machined metal post to affix the "slide thru" ( for lack of the correct word ) get many compliments on it and it works very well as a daily driver. next time i might use only one spool.....

    cd
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    Not enough Zs yet! nwcubsman's Avatar
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    Default

    The retractable shoulder belt can be removed from a wrecking yard '75 (maybe other years also) and it will bolt right into your '72. The coupe version only. The 2+2 had the retractor behind the plastic trim. The belt will need to be sewn onto your stock metal clip that snaps into the receiver. Beandip has it completed. I have the parts, but haven't installed it yet.
    Bryan
    ___________________________________________
    12/72 240Z, HLS30139612
    2/73 240Z, HLS30149546
    IZCC #14892

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    Default Scroth seat belts?

    Thanks for the help guys. Yawl have some really sweet Z's!
    I just have to pick one of the options for the belts. I dont think the Scroth belts will work with the stock seats. Has anyone tried them?

  8. #8
    Supporting Member boyblunda's Avatar
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    Default Seat Belt Options

    Found this possibly helpful thread on a seat belt search
    http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/s...ght=seat+belts
    http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/s...ght=seat+belts
    Also found a couple of other threads I thought might be useful with titles that specifically adressed seat belts but you need a bit of time to browse, read and absorb. Personally, I think that time would be well spent given how we all hope that we never need seat belts but really want them to work well when the moment arrives.
    For road use you can get seat belts that appear to be in good condition from newer or low mileage cars. However, I am currently querying the value of older seat belts in my own cars as I am concerned about the unknown history of the belts in my cars - I do not know if they have been involved in any previous incidents and I am unsure about the integrity of the belts with age. How many of us have a little fuzzy edge on our seat belts?
    I do some climbing, caving and rope rescue activities in my work and there is a five year limit on any rope, tapes and webbing (similar to seat belts) that we use. Webbing is usually much more prone to damage and is retired earlier. I have no problem with refurbishing some of my equipment with replacement tape and webbing provided that I am happy of the quality of the work provided - the fabric is not the problem as that can be bought anywhere, the quality of the stitching is critical.
    My personal choices in what your situation would be to either have the belts refurbished by a reputable provider or to buy new belts - I would lean toward the latter if you are going to compete in autocross.
    The above is a personal perspective only.
    Last edited by boyblunda; 08-21-2006 at 04:00 AM.
    Dave
    GRS30 010961 L26 148904 260Z 2+2 5/1976 manual black driven on fine days
    RS30 000812 was L26073225 (now L28) 260Z manual 1/1974 project car (refresh only)

  9. #9
    Supporting Member boyblunda's Avatar
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    Default Seat Belt Options

    Deleted. Posted twice in error. Sorry.
    Last edited by boyblunda; 08-21-2006 at 03:57 AM.
    Dave
    GRS30 010961 L26 148904 260Z 2+2 5/1976 manual black driven on fine days
    RS30 000812 was L26073225 (now L28) 260Z manual 1/1974 project car (refresh only)

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    Default Safety issue????

    Boyblunda,
    Thanks for the write up. Some interesting points were brought up. It might be something a lot of people need to think about. During the tear down of the 240 we had several LARGE bolt snap with ease. If thick metal can wear down so much over the years... what about the fabric webbing that make up the seat belts? We pour tons of money into these cars and often overlook items such as seat belts. I was in the Army for 8 years and jumped out of planes and helicopters many... many times, also did some repelling. I sometimes wondered about the integrity of the gear and ropes we were using. A lot of the stuff was VERY old including the parachutes! The seat belts in these old cars may very well look and feel as if they have maintained their strength but in fact they have not. The problem is compounded further by the fact that we are relying on 30+ year old safety engineering. Thats 2 strikes... outdated safety and belts that have weakened over the years. The third strike and catylist to injury is the car accident itself.
    Wow, I haven't really thought about this. I guess what ever we do it will most likely be something newer! I guess I will have to research if the Scroth belts will work with the stock seats.

  11. #11
    CDavid c david's Avatar
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    Default we drive unsafe cars

    there are over 1300 models of cars for sale in the us and over 90 % of them out weigh us by 1000 lbs. in addition they are excedingly stronger and are designed to resist cars that are as strong and as heavy as themselves.

    senario 1. you will walk away concerned about the damage to your car.

    senario 2. you are seriously injured and have far more to worrry about than the condition of your car.

    i agree with you. i drive in fear and i fear the guy with the "fear this" sticker. the only protection i have is defensive driving, good breaks, fat tires and a strong new seat belt.

    i have been employed with federal express as a driver and logged many hundreds of thousands of miles, sometimes driving 250 plus miles a day for weeks on end. i have been trained by career road safety specialist who have millions of miles and 30 years spending 40 plus hours a week working with others who do the same. they give good advice.
    the bottom line is we are vulnerable on the road and in a car that cannot stand up against a collision with most any other car just forget the trees, walls and even the ground if you get angeled down a ditch.

    so, strap in stay away from all the stationary objects and have a plan for the drivers who get loose in the rain or loose in the head.

    i was at my statefarm agent today to put her back on the road as a daily driver. i hope i never have to claim on the policy and hope to never hear a story about a zcar losing an impact battle.....

    stay safe, cdavid

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    Default

    I did install the '75 shoulder belts and re tractors and they work vary well . As nucubsman said , I had the '73 metal clips sewn in just as they were by a shoe repair shop and you cannot tell it was done .
    I'd rather die while I am living than live while I am dieing. CZC 1887 IZCC 12602 Member of NorthWest Z Car Club

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    i got t-boned by a 97 cavelier.....cavelier had small damage under 1500 (front bumper)....my 240z..totaled bent unibody. My lap belt did not lock up. However that worked to my advantage as i was thrown on top of my center console and the seat belt stopped me at full extension. This prevented me from being smashed in between the tranny tunnel and the door.

    my car did not have shoulder belts.

  14. #14
    Z Club of San Diego Montezuma's Avatar
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    I bought a set of retractable belts from Wesco for my 73. They are so much better than the originals. They bolted right in with a small "L" bracket. Check out there webpage: www.wescoperformance.com/ They have great customer service too, my belts arrived within a day from date or order. I would highly recommend this product to any 240Z owner.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Montezuma
    I bought a set of retractable belts from Wesco for my 73. They are so much better than the originals. They bolted right in with a small "L" bracket. Check out there webpage: www.wescoperformance.com/ They have great customer service too, my belts arrived within a day from date or order. I would highly recommend this product to any 240Z owner.
    Montezuma, which model did you choose? Did the retractor for the lap portion fit into the "pocket" that holds the factory's retractor? Or is it mounted outside?

    Also, did you go with a retractable shoulder belt? I've been looking for a combination lap/shoulder that's retractable that will fit my '73 without successs so far. Perhaps you've found the solution
    Daniel
    '73 240Z
    Castle Rock, CO

  16. #16
    Z Club of San Diego Montezuma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 240ZMan
    Montezuma, which model did you choose? Did the retractor for the lap portion fit into the "pocket" that holds the factory's retractor? Or is it mounted outside?

    Also, did you go with a retractable shoulder belt? I've been looking for a combination lap/shoulder that's retractable that will fit my '73 without successs so far. Perhaps you've found the solution
    I feel that I have found "the solution". I allowed the customer service rep that answered the phone help to get the right set for my car, I am believe I have the I3207 model along with the angle bracket. I did get the bracket pictured but when I ordered an additional one they sent me a thinner version that looked much better installed. The retractor fits nicely behind the seat but not in the pocket that held the factory unit. The other thing I had to do was cut the bottom the plastic holder for the recieptical which worked out great too. My wife used to hate to ride in the car because the old belts were a pain to work, she is very happy with the new belts as well.
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  17. #17
    Enjoying the ride... 240ZMan's Avatar
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    This is great Montezuma, thanks for letting me ask 20 questions!

    I was wondering how you mounted the retractor behind the seat? Looks like there are 2 bolts holding the stock retractor in. I'm guessing that the one farthest from the door was used for the retractor, and the one closest to the door for the other end of the belt? Is that correct? Or did you use the bracket to mount both the retractor and the belt end to the same outer bolt?

    And which mounting point did you use up top? Here's a picture of my car. Did you use A or B? I'm guessing B because that's where the original factory was attached.

    Any chance of a picture?
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    Daniel
    '73 240Z
    Castle Rock, CO

  18. #18
    Z Club of San Diego Montezuma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 240ZMan
    This is great Montezuma, thanks for letting me ask 20 questions!

    I was wondering how you mounted the retractor behind the seat? Looks like there are 2 bolts holding the stock retractor in. I'm guessing that the one farthest from the door was used for the retractor, and the one closest to the door for the other end of the belt? Is that correct? Or did you use the bracket to mount both the retractor and the belt end to the same outer bolt?

    And which mounting point did you use up top? Here's a picture of my car. Did you use A or B? I'm guessing B because that's where the original factory was attached.

    Any chance of a picture?
    I used the angle bracket on position B of your picture. This is a three point belt, so what you do is mount the retrator right where the factor one was located then the pulley at point B of your picture. The end goes right inside the door by by the sill or outer bolt. You will need one extra nut and bolt for the angle bracket. I will try to take pictures tonight after I get home if I can.

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    Enjoying the ride... 240ZMan's Avatar
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    Ah, that clears things up some.

    I just spoke to them and the woman also suggested the WELR-N belt which would have the retractor mounted directly at "B" in my previous picture. Did you consider that one? I figure it's an easier installation, no brackets are involved, but you do have the retractor out in the open where it's visible. Not the most attractive, but I'm thinking it might be a bit more robust in an accident since there's no bracket that could twist/break.

    I hope I'm not over analyzing this, but given it's about our safety, I figure it's better to err this way...
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    Daniel
    '73 240Z
    Castle Rock, CO

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    Semi-retired admin Arne's Avatar
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    I wonder which choice I'd want for my early car that came with no retractor pocket anyway? Mount a retractor down low, or up high? Hmm...
    Arne - Former owner, HLS30-37705, 7/71, 905 Red
    Car blogs - 240Z - Porsche 911

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    Z Club of San Diego Montezuma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arne
    I wonder which choice I'd want for my early car that came with no retractor pocket anyway? Mount a retractor down low, or up high? Hmm...
    I mounted mine behind the seat and it works great...not an eyesore. I don't think the picture that Daniel put up will work with the retrator high right behind the seat.

  22. #22
    Z Club of San Diego Montezuma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 240ZMan
    Ah, that clears things up some.

    I just spoke to them and the woman also suggested the WELR-N belt which would have the retractor mounted directly at "B" in my previous picture. Did you consider that one? I figure it's an easier installation, no brackets are involved, but you do have the retractor out in the open where it's visible. Not the most attractive, but I'm thinking it might be a bit more robust in an accident since there's no bracket that could twist/break.

    I hope I'm not over analyzing this, but given it's about our safety, I figure it's better to err this way...
    I personally don't like the recommendation of the C/R. It might work....but I am not sure. I am not afraid that the brackets will not hold up in a wreck.

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    Enjoying the ride... 240ZMan's Avatar
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    There's a guy here local with a '71 or '72 who has the retractors mounted up on "B" as shown in my picture. I had wanted to emulate his install, but he didn't know where the seatbelts had come from. Now I'm guessing it's WELR-N from Wesco.

    Side note: his car looks a lot like Arne's, same color. Excellent condition!
    Daniel
    '73 240Z
    Castle Rock, CO

  24. #24
    long time owner a7dz's Avatar
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    Arne

    I was thinking it will go down low as we don't have the pocket to contend with was looking at mine this morning. The real question comes on where to put the pivot? There is no place above the quarter window to mount it with out welding in a doubler and anchor. I would guess just behind where the hook is now. I know the retractor Bean dip used was back by the hatch. I am at the point where I need to make a decision soon. I want to get the paint on this one soon.
    Jim
    Bought my 70Z at 21 with 24,000 miles
    Still own it. Thirty plus years later.


  25. #25
    Enjoying the ride... 240ZMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Montezuma
    I am afraid that the brackets will not hold up in a wreck.
    I agree, I have the same concern. If I go that route, I'll either mount the retractor's tab directly with the existing bolt, or fab a small bracket with a very minor bend (~15 degrees)in it so that the retractor will clear the curved roof section near there. That way if there is a big "pull" on the retractor, I won't have to worry about the bracket twisting and bending.
    Daniel
    '73 240Z
    Castle Rock, CO

  26. #26
    Supporting Member boyblunda's Avatar
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    Default Retractables Maintaining Tension

    Thomas, I am really pleased that you seem to have elected to go the competition harness route as no standard belt will compare to the firmness and resultant safety of a four point harness in autocross.
    I would even prefer to use them on a normal road car as I am quite a large guy and find that conventional retractable seat belts do not retain the initial firm feel that we would want at the point of any impact - our Zeds do not have pre tensioners like some modern cars. Videos of crash test dummies in vehicle incidents show that they move around more than enough with the belts taking up tension on the body so we hardly need to start with a restraint system that is not firm.
    I am not recommending that we should all move away from retractable systems as my thoughts come from the perspective of a person with a body shape that it is not compatible with the initial fitting of a seat belt retaining its firmness, and is aimed at the original question from Thomas who is thinking of using his vehicle for autocross.
    I do not think we have anything less than lap / sash (shoulder) belts in Australian Zeds and I think that all came out with retractable belts. It is interesting to hear the comments on options available to the North American owners.
    Dave
    GRS30 010961 L26 148904 260Z 2+2 5/1976 manual black driven on fine days
    RS30 000812 was L26073225 (now L28) 260Z manual 1/1974 project car (refresh only)

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