New owner of a very early 240Z

[metalmonkey47]

Well guys, this is my first Z but not my first Datsun. I've had an '81 210, and a 75 620 with a build LZ22. I came across this 240Z from a customer at work, who I've been helping along for years, hoping one day he'll remember me if he ever decided to sell it. Fortunately, the day came.

I picked up this car so cheap, I won't say because I'm afraid I'll break someone's heart. She's a 100% legit 03/70 with a vin of 2563. Yep, Pretty freaking early since the '69's vin ran up to somewhere in the area of 1700. It's complete, and seems to have an original 55,000 miles! No worn pedal pads, dash has one small crack, seats are good except some small cracking, interior is complete minus carpet, etc etc. Hell the car is still equipped with the factory exhaust, minus the edition of a cool looking muffler at the end.

Enough with the info though, I can get back to that in a little bit. I'm hoping someone can weigh in on the 'rarity' of such an early Z.

Here's a simple picture my girlfriend took after we picked her up. It needs a wash, and a new front bumper (looks like someone tried to tow it)

[metalmonkey47]

Here she is with my 620

[northernz]

Hey Metal Monkey, congratulations on the nice Zed! Finding an early Vin car in good shape is fairly rare, however I don't think it is a low enough VIN to be worth any more because of the fact. It is still pretty cool though! Post lots more pics, especially of the rust prone areas, and you have to tell us what you paid for it!
Welcome to the site,
Mark

[26th-Z]

...since the '69's vin ran up to somewhere in the area of 1700.

Congratulations! I don't understand what you mean. The total number of HLS30s built in 1969 is far less than 1700 - far less. Your car is on Carl Beck's registry Classic Z Car Register

Looks like you will be having fun with your early car.

[motorman7]

Congrats on picking up a nice looking Z. My S/N 2614 is about 50 units after yours. Mine was made in March of 1970 per the inside door tag

[hr369]

sell it to me so you can put some paint on that 620. Im curious as to how it made it from
glendale az to atlanta. anybody know dean tilton? maybe he'd be interested in where it is
now.


edit: Dean Tilton passed away. i do believe this car was his pride and joy.



Dean Tilton Obituary: View Dean Tilton's Obituary by The Arizona Republic

[metalmonkey47]

Thanks guys! You've been a lot better off so far then Hybridz (I hate that place after 2 posts) Everyone there could only tell me to V8 swap it. Annoying.

Sad to see Dean passed away, I was hoping to learn a little about the history on the car. Sadly I don't think I ever will.
Anyways, the car came to me for $1000. It's got some VERY strange wiring issues that I've been sorting through. About 12 hours with a meter and I've managed to restore function to the headlights, turn signals, hazards, and brake lights. The wipers are dead slow (which might be in the motor) and something is drawing a massive load on the left turn signal. Got a little smoke from the switch so i need to figure that out.

The car is 100% rust free except some small holes under the drivers side seating area. About the size of a tennis ball on both sides. Minor, and an easy fix.

Other then the issue with the wiring that resulted from some half ass 'mechanic' playing electrician, the car came to me with a blown head gasket, trashed half shafts, and missing hatch. All of which have been rectified. The L24 is SUPER responsive with an N47 head on it. The E31 sustained some damage which will be repaired in the future and put back on the car with some power adders. The hatch is in paint, and halfshafts were replaced with some off of a parts car. Soon I'll have fresh U joints in them and I'll be driving this puppy every day.


For now, here are some more pictures. Please keep in mind, this car is all original and un-restored.

[SteveJ]

I see you found your way over here, Matt. Did you get the electrical gremlins worked out?

By the way guys, he's not joking about the price he paid for it.

[cbuczesk]

That's a nice looking Z!

Chuck

[metalmonkey47]

I see you found your way over here, Matt. Did you get the electrical gremlins worked out?

By the way guys, he's not joking about the price he paid for it.

Hey Steven, nice to see some locals over here.

Turns out the majority of the issues are a result of some home grown GA ghetto mechanics. Several wires out of the fuse block were mutilated and chopped up, then put back together with wiring nuts. No bueno. I've been tracing wires, and I'm very familiar with the function of almost every wire in a Series 1 now. Not something I'm proud of having to know... I still have an issue though, when the hazards are on they flash very fast, then slow down which indicates a short somewhere (drawing extra current, slowing down the load flasher) with the left side turn signals on, I did get a little smoke out of the turn signal switch so I know it's somewhere on that side of the car.

Just some random pics of some of what I've had to deal with.....

That's a nice looking Z!

Chuck

Thanks man!

[metalmonkey47]

Found a picture of this old girl probably back in the 90's! MAN she looked good!

[djwarner]

Hi Metal Monkey,

The wipers are notoriously slow on a dry windshield and will park high. Probably the least of your worries right now. Many early Z's were hacked into race cars due to their lighter weight. This only increases the rarity of a Series I restoration candidate.

Current price premium for a Series I can easily be swamped by condition issues. That said, last year a Classic Motorsports Magazine article listed the Series I car first on their list of affordable classic cars with potential to appreciate. Their recommendation was to preserve them for next owner rather than attempting to restore today.

You say you have acquired a hatch. Series I hatches have vents and defroster lines running vertically. Later hatches will work just fine - only brought it up for future potential restoration issues.

[metalmonkey47]

Thanks DJ, this one will remain original, other then some minor fun mods, shorter springs, better dampeners, maybe a fun L28 (keep the L24 to the side... it's #'s matching) But everything on the car will be period correct. I have some SSR MK3's for the car when It's driveable. I hope to order some BRE body parts (front spoiler) in the future. I also have a spare wiper motor (in fact we have a whole spare '73, some parts are interchangeable) that I'm going to clean up and re-grease, hopefully I'll get a little better speed out of this one once the linkages are all greased.

My hatch is a true Series 1, although it's missing the vents it is a vertical striped Series 1.

[northernz]

Wow, 1000 bucks for what looks like a very solid car is a steal! Congrats again. Cleaning and greasing the wiper linkages will speed them up considerably. Have fun cleaning her up, she will look great once again!

[SteveJ]

Get up with me about the wiper linkages. I'll show you what to look out for so you don't make the same mistakes I did.

[metalmonkey47]

Wow, 1000 bucks for what looks like a very solid car is a steal! Congrats again. Cleaning and greasing the wiper linkages will speed them up considerably. Have fun cleaning her up, she will look great once again!

Yeah it's a hell of a deal! The PO that sold it to me had it since 2003, and has been coming to me (I work in parts retail) for parts and when he's had issues the last 4 years and I've been able to assist him everytime he's had an issue, just to keep it running. The head gasket was easy, tracking down everything else in the wiring is the tough part.

Any suggestions on a type of grease for assembly? I have some Mobil 1 bearing grease (the red high temp) that I used on all of the linkages for the carbs that seems to be working very well.

Get up with me about the wiper linkages. I'll show you what to look out for so you don't make the same mistakes I did.

Will do man! I'll shoot ya a message over Facebook before I get into them.

[grannyknot]

metalmonkey, I have been watching this thread, I have a 03/70 with the last four numbers 1955. Maybe someday the low VIN will be worth something but not really right now. You got a great deal! You might want to check the archives for
Honda wiper motor, it's very simple change over and gives you modern speed wipers. When you get caught in a summer down pour you'll be glad that you didn't stick to original.
Chris

[Galaxybj]

Thats a nice find there. Too bad you are having to deal with all the electrical, but better you than me ;-) Curious ' bout the brake master cylinder. Never seen one like that on a Z.

[metalmonkey47]

metalmonkey, I have been watching this thread, I have a 03/70 with the last four numbers 1955. Maybe someday the low VIN will be worth something but not really right now. You got a great deal! You might want to check the archives for
Honda wiper motor, it's very simple change over and gives you modern speed wipers. When you get caught in a summer down pour you'll be glad that you didn't stick to original.
Chris

Thanks man! I had never heard about the Honda wiper motor swap until now, our weather can go from a drizzle to a torrential downpour in minutes so it helps to have faster wipers.

Thats a nice find there. Too bad you are having to deal with all the electrical, but better you than me ;-) Curious ' bout the brake master cylinder. Never seen one like that on a Z.

Yeah electrical is no fun....but I can manage it.

The master cylinder is Tokico branded, not sure if it's original or a reman.





Found the issue with my intermittent headlights. Gotta giggle the switch sometimes. Not anymore.





Also I wiped the car down with some quick wax and a Mr. Clean Magic Eraser. The car is superrrrr clean under all this grime. I'll buff it out after I clay-bar it.

[Carl Beck]

My hatch is a true Series 1, although it's missing the vents it is a vertical striped Series 1.

Hi metalmonkey:
Great Buy - I would have snapped that up in a heart beat for grand. Do you mean that the chrome covers over the vents are missing? Or do you mean there are no holes in the deck lid for vents? The 240Z's had vertical strip rear window defroster lines - up until the first few months of 1972. So that doesn't really tell you much…

BTW - # 2562 was reported owned by Classic Z Car forum member: er34gtt2000jp

Anyway - good luck and enjoy the process.
Carl B.

[CanTechZ]

[QUOTE=metalmonkey47;454705]
The master cylinder is Tokico branded, not sure if it's original or a reman.



Your master cylinder looks to me like it might be the later one used from 9/71 on, with the front reservoir towards the booster but it was modified using two of the larger front reservoirs.

Nice find and good luck from a fellow series one owner.


Mike

[GeoJoe]

Nice find! I bet someone would pay a grand just for those headlight covers. Can't wait to see ya at Caffeine and Octane in Alpharetta sometime.

I'm digging the old school 96 Rock plate on your truck too. Brings back a lot of memories.

[metalmonkey47]

Hi metalmonkey:
Great Buy - I would have snapped that up in a heart beat for grand. Do you mean that the chrome covers over the vents are missing? Or do you mean there are no holes in the deck lid for vents? The 240Z's had vertical strip rear window defroster lines - up until the first few months of 1972. So that doesn't really tell you much…

BTW - # 2562 was reported owned by Classic Z Car forum member: er34gtt2000jp

Anyway - good luck and enjoy the process.
Carl B.

Hey Carl, it actually is the rear vents on the hatch that are missing, but I have found several on Ebay that look fine, so it's not a big deal to find. I need the original badging as well, but other then that I should be okay. It is a vertical striped hatch.

[QUOTE=CanTechZ;454740]

The master cylinder is Tokico branded, not sure if it's original or a reman.



Your master cylinder looks to me like it might be the later one used from 9/71 on, with the front reservoir towards the booster but it was modified using two of the larger front reservoirs.

Nice find and good luck from a fellow series one owner.


Mike

Interesting, is there any benefit of running the later master cylinder? Different bore size maybe? I can't see any reason why someone would go from stock on such an original car, unless the original wasn't availible at the time.

Nice find! I bet someone would pay a grand just for those headlight covers. Can't wait to see ya at Caffeine and Octane in Alpharetta sometime.

I'm digging the old school 96 Rock plate on your truck too. Brings back a lot of memories.

I'd hope not! haha they look exactly like the MSA ones. I actually need a new set. Unfortunately, someone pushed against the headlight cover on the drivers side when we were moving it off of the tow dolly, and shattered it so I'll need another set. Fortunatly, a tinted set run about $70 on thezstore.com

You'll see me at C&O soon! I'm hoping to have the Z on the road this weekend, then I'll plan on making it to C&O. Just look for the 96 Rock plate


Also if you haven't already and you're on Facebook, look up Georgia Datsun Owners. We have a growing community there with lots of Z people.

[Captain Obvious]

they look exactly like the MSA ones. I actually need a new set. Unfortunately, someone pushed against the headlight cover on the drivers side when we were moving it off of the tow dolly, and shattered it so I'll need another set.

Unless you've now got your heart set on the tinted ones... I've got a set of NOS clear covers from MSA if you're interested. Bought them for a Z a while ago but sold the car before I installed them. Still wrapped up in the box. LMK if you're interested? Save some bucks?

[CanTechZ]

Interesting, is there any benefit of running the later master cylinder? Different bore size maybe? I can't see any reason why someone would go from stock on such an original car, unless the original wasn't availible at the time.

Both the early master cylinder (for use up to Aug '71) and the later one have a 7/8" bore, as far as I know the early one has been harder to find and therefore usually more expensive. The early one P/N 46010-E4602 can still be ordered from Nissan Dealerships, I have one on order right now due for delivery from Japan to western Canada by the end of this month. I went this way both for originality and ease of installation, ie: no brake line modifications required.

Mike

[metalmonkey47]

Unless you've now got your heart set on the tinted ones... I've got a set of NOS clear covers from MSA if you're interested. Bought them for a Z a while ago but sold the car before I installed them. Still wrapped up in the box. LMK if you're interested? Save some bucks?

I wouldn't mind having them. I'll shoot you a PM in a little bit when i get a chance, not ready for them quite yet as the car isn't yet on the road, but I'm interested for sure.

Both the early master cylinder (for use up to Aug '71) and the later one have a 7/8" bore, as far as I know the early one has been harder to find and therefore usually more expensive. The early one P/N 46010-E4602 can still be ordered from Nissan Dealerships, I have one on order right now due for delivery from Japan to western Canada by the end of this month. I went this way both for originality and ease of installation, ie: no brake line modifications required.

Mike

Interesting. Thanks for the P/N, I'd like to stay as close to original as possible so I'll check with my local Nissan guy and see if they can get there hands on one for a good price. It is on my replace list, I have no clue how old this thing is.


Also, I've heard a little about using mid 80's Yota 4x4 calipers on a 240z, and that they bolt onto the stock location with no modifications, using a stock rotor. Does this use the standard brake line, or are there modifications required to use this caliper? Also has anyone had fitment issues inside 14'' rims? Anyone that might be able to toss in some words would be great help...


Last but not least, I did get a chance to finally rub some nice Meguires compound on the hood just for a test spot, and man the paint sure clears up nice! It's hard to tell from this poor picture, but there's quite a nice shine, almost mirror-like, and it's not even polished or waxed. Wow I love enamel paint.




Oh yeah, just for entertainment purposes, a friend I went to high school with and his '76 Celica. It's got a Yota Tacoma motor stock as a rock with a nice HX35 turbo setup, and some piggyback ECM. Not sure what exactly.

[Captain Obvious]

I wouldn't mind having them. I'll shoot you a PM in a little bit when i get a chance, not ready for them quite yet as the car isn't yet on the road, but I'm interested for sure.

Sent you a PM with some pics of the headlight covers. LMK what you think?

[brownclee]

You mentioned that the only rust issue you've found are in the floor board areas. It's very likely that you have a leak in the cowl area and the water found it's way down the inside of the firewall and under the sound deadening material. This is a very common problem. The cowl drains clog and water stands in the cowl area and gets into the passenger compartment via some areas inside the cowl that didn't get sealed well from the factory. I would check this soon if I were you. You could have some serious rust issues in the floor board/foot well area that have only just begun to present themselves. Great car. Good luck.

[metalmonkey47]

You mentioned that the only rust issue you've found are in the floor board areas. It's very likely that you have a leak in the cowl area and the water found it's way down the inside of the firewall and under the sound deadening material. This is a very common problem. The cowl drains clog and water stands in the cowl area and gets into the passenger compartment via some areas inside the cowl that didn't get sealed well from the factory. I would check this soon if I were you. You could have some serious rust issues in the floor board/foot well area that have only just begun to present themselves. Great car. Good luck.

Thanks for the advice man! There's a good chance that's where it is. The rust looks all to be at the lowest point in the floor so there's a good chance that is what it is. I'll be ripping the wiper motor/linkages out soon so I'll check the cowl drains as soon as I do that. (Obviously)


I got the car home tonight! It runs magnificent. Only issue I see at this point is that the car punishes me for trying to beat on it. Under load/full throttle it chokes and I've gotten a few nice pops from the exhaust. Very same symptoms my LZ22 in the 620 showed after the first drive, which was rectified with a little more advance. I haven't checked the timing yet, but now that I have it at home with all my tools I'll be doing that.

^^any feedback would be great.

So stoked that the car only cost me $67 per month to insure.

[bacarl]

You mentioned that the only rust issue you've found are in the floor board areas. It's very likely that you have a leak in the cowl area and the water found it's way down the inside of the firewall and under the sound deadening material. This is a very common problem. The cowl drains clog and water stands in the cowl area and gets into the passenger compartment via some areas inside the cowl that didn't get sealed well from the factory. I would check this soon if I were you. You could have some serious rust issues in the floor board/foot well area that have only just begun to present themselves. Great car. Good luck.

Where are those troublesome cowl drains? Like under the grille in the exterior cowl?

[metalmonkey47]

Where are those troublesome cowl drains? Like under the grille in the exterior cowl?

If it's anything like my 210 I had, they would exit down in the fenders. The water would drain down the cowl out of the drivers side and passenger side inner fenders, but they clog with dirt and trash, so the water would collect in the cowl.

I got the car home last night! We wrestled the glass into the hatch for about 3 hours until we were able to make it fit. I drove the car this morning to work and it presented a few issues. I have a clunk accelerating that needs to be addressed. We just put good axle shafts in, and the driveshaft joints felt tight when i was under it so I'll have to look at the rear end tomorrow.

The car was running pig rich, so bad it would hurt your eyes and at 4000RPM or under heavy loads (up hill at heavy throttle) it would cut up and billow black smoke from the pipes. I balanced the carbs out by ear and with my hands for the time being, and set the timing and she runs like a top!!

First picture after her bath for now.

[Blue]

i balanced the carbs out by ear and with my hands for the time being, and set the timing and she runs like a top!!

like

[rossiz]

...I balanced the carbs out by ear and with my hands for the time being, and set the timing and she runs like a top!!...

nothing more satisfying than getting a decent base tune with a couple of hand tools, your eyes and ears :}

she looks great - can't wait to hear the rest of the story as the de-bugging continues

[Mikes Z car]

This picture of a drain hole on the left side of the car was taken with the cowl removed. I think this is my car before I did any anti rust in this area.

[metalmonkey47]

Update:

The timing has really confused me. At some point someone must have dropped the oil pump, because the distributor is off by quite a bit. I can't get enough advance. It starts to break up at 4000-4500. No more revs under load after that. With my cheap timing light it's WAY off the timing table.... gotta drop the oil pump and get it figured out.


Other then that, I've been happy with it! It has NO dash lights, so I'm a little disappointed by that. I hate electrical gremlins.

A little picture for now.

[SteveJ]

Matt, bring it by my house. If the wiring was messed up too bad by IPOs, I can help you with the gremlins quickly.

[bartsscooterservice]

Honda wiper motor, it's very simple change over and gives you modern speed wipers. When you get caught in a summer down pour you'll be glad that you didn't stick to original.
Chris

I think that's a personal thing, I have no problems with my stock 2 speed wipers.

[SMAZCO]

Update:


Other then that, I've been happy with it! It has NO dash lights, so I'm a little disappointed by that. I hate electrical gremlins.

Not sure if you checked, but the dimmer for the lights is on the right side of the steering column. Mine was hidden by the aftermarket A/C control so I thought the same thing. I just bought it, so rookie mistake and put a smile on my face when I rotated it and tada, dash lights worked. The knob on the other side is the mileage reset knob. Pretty cool. I'll try and get mine posted soon as well. '71 as well.

[brownclee]

The cowl drains are to the out board ends of the cowl area. They acutally drain through rubber hoses (about 1.25" dia.) that pass from the bottom of the lower cowl pan, through the passenger compartment and out through the a-post structure ahead and above the upper door hinges and inside the rear of the fender. They are also the culprit for causing lower rear fender rust as any debris that passes through them collects inside the fender rearward of the wheel opening. Datsn, made a big error in that design. They should have routed the drains all the way down to prevent moisture collection inside the fenders. The moral to the story is to check the drains periodically for function. Water stayed into cowl vents at the base of the windshield should quickly make it's way to the ground behind the front wheels. If not, you have an issue that requires immediate attention. You should also, flush the area behind the front wheels each time you wash the car to remove any debris that will collect there.

[metalmonkey47]

Not sure if you checked, but the dimmer for the lights is on the right side of the steering column. Mine was hidden by the aftermarket A/C control so I thought the same thing. I just bought it, so rookie mistake and put a smile on my face when I rotated it and tada, dash lights worked. The knob on the other side is the mileage reset knob. Pretty cool. I'll try and get mine posted soon as well. '71 as well.

I literally had NO idea what either one of the knobs did under the dash until Ir read that, WOW! Alas, it didn't fix the issue, but damn did it make me feel a little less stupid.

Matt, bring it by my house. If the wiring was messed up too bad by IPOs, I can help you with the gremlins quickly.

I will surely take you up on that offer once I get this thing running better.



I thought i'd share a little update. I'll be back with many more pictures, but man I love cheap radiators. $131 on Egay, not the best quality but by far better then the busted one I had.

[metalmonkey47]

Just wanted to share some pictures of my recent progress Hope you guys enjoy!

_DSC0521 by metalmonkey47, on Flickr

Lucy by metalmonkey47, on Flickr

Lucy by metalmonkey47, on Flickr

Lucy by metalmonkey47, on Flickr

[Fred Sigarto]

Lookin better all the time ..... great progress!

[SteveJ]

You are going to be at C&O in two weeks, right?

[bartsscooterservice]

great progress !

I would use a bottle of mequairs ultimate compound and some towels, spent an afternoon polishing it up, and that paint will look way better , worked great on mine.

[GeoJoe]

You are going to be at C&O in two weeks, right?

I was going the ask the same thing. Looking good metal monkey!

[SteveJ]

So does that mean you're show up, too?

[metalmonkey47]

You are going to be at C&O in two weeks, right?

Yessir! Unless something at work comes up I'll be there!

great progress !

I would use a bottle of mequairs ultimate compound and some towels, spent an afternoon polishing it up, and that paint will look way better , worked great on mine.

Actually, I've used the Meguires Ultimate Compound and Polish, then Waxed with the same stuff. Turned out great! Only issue is that It tends to fade quickly and water-spot easily. I don't know if it's Georgia's acidic rain, or an issue with the pain but unless you polish often it tends to look like crap after a wash.

[Carl Beck]

metalmonkey47 - - you are seeing / experiencing the effects that happen, when the top layer of an older formula enamel has been polished off. While you still have a color coat below that top layer of paint - you no longer have the density of paint solids that originally formed in that shinny top skin layer.

Time for a new paint job..
Carl B.

[metalmonkey47]

Thanks Carl! I think I'll buy some time while I work towards a new daily driver.

I was able to do some WONDERS with the right products. Fine grit Meguiers compound, and Ultimate Polish. No wax 'yet.' I have a lot more work to do, but here she is!

After C&O last month, you guys really kicked my ass into high gear. My car was the nastiest of the group.



HUGE difference over stock. (This was after getting it home. Look how nasty the hood is.)




And because I'm feeling nostalgic, my old '75 620. Had a built long rod stroker, .475 Racer brown cam, etc etc. Man I miss that truck.