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Thread: FUMES... Give me a break!

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    SennaVsProst sennavsprost's Avatar
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    Default FUMES... Give me a break!

    OK, no new story for us Z owners, exhaust fumes getting in the cockpit. However I've covered most bases, and still cant seem to figure it out... I've replaced the rear hatch seal and weatherstripping, adjusted the latch so that it closes very tight. replaced taillight gaskets, and even silicone sealed the outer edges as well of the lights. Took out interior panels and expanding latex sealed the inner fender edges, sealed around all grommets for the fuel tank lines and replaced all grommets in the rear. I even just for the sake of trying took some gaffers tape and taped my hatch shut closing all the areas where fumes could sneak in, and still fumes!! I have a side exit exhaust that when I have on, i get no fumes at all, but with any rear exiting exhaust i get fumed out like crazy... anyone have any other suggestions?? I'm going to the Monterey Historic Auto races from Los Angeles so i dont feel like breathing fumes for that long of a trip. Oh yeah one other thing, with my windows up, I dont get fumes at all, only with windows down.

    Dave.
    HLS30-06143 - 905 Orange - 1970 (6/70). Period correct Yokohama bridge crosser to come.

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    Default

    Only a couple things that might help, since you seem to have tried them all. Have you checked and/or replaced the rubber plugs in the floor? The one in the spare tire well? The one under the console in the "pocket" under the ashtray?

    Since you say it only does it when the windows are open creating a vacuum, I'd say it might also be in the firewall.... or around the doors.... or....

    Have you tried extending your tail pipe a few more inches? Maybe go to the parts store and just buy a cheap chrome extension to just try it?

    That's about all I can think of, you've already covered all the obvious ones....
    "If it weren't for fools, the rest of us could not succeed." Mark Twain.

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    Zedaholic That Ozzy Guy's Avatar
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    Default

    I get lots of fumes in my car. The worst kind are crank case fumes which are pretty toxic and I get them all the time. I think it's time for an oil catch can. I never realised how bad the fumes were until about two weeks ago. On top of that, the design of my extractors makes it impossible to prevent exhaust fumes. The torque bends the flange (horizontal) at the end of the extractor and when it bends back the pipes stay at a slight angle while the extractor itself is in the original position creating a small gap. I've hammered the flange back but it just happens again. The thread positioning is not helping the situation. Next extractors will definately have vertical flanges with a recess in the middle to further prevent leaks. The recess also means you can do away with gaskets but it's advisable to have a thin one just so that the flange doesn't get stuck together from the heat.

    It's weird that you don't get fumes with windows down but I suspect you will find your answer will have something to do with vacuum like Keith mentioned.

    If all else fails, have no fear, you will get used to them. Mine are so bad that I end up crying after a 30 minute trip and I'm still alive. Although I have developed a slight twitch and my skin is flaking a bit.

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    Registered User sjcurtis's Avatar
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    Default

    Dave,
    you say you gaffa taped the hatch closed. did you run the tape along the back edge above the tail lights and the numberplate, so the natch to rear panel was sealed off. I am wandering if the two hach blank grommets in back of the hatch have holes in them.
    If you are good with the windows up then your vent system is functioning efficiently.
    The other place you may have air holes is on the tail light surround panel, right in the top right and top left of the insert, it may not visible even if you can slip a coin through it, it is normally hidden by the grey light surround panels x 3. If you have holes this size you will have tears in your eyes with the windows down (I did).
    My2c
    Steve

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    Default

    I find both windows down simeltaneously helps improve the fumes situation alot as oppose to one down.

    Can't help with any other suggestion sorry.

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    Supporting Member EScanlon's Avatar
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    Default

    In the area where the electric antena sits, take a look at the "floor" there, there is the drainage hole for the antenna, and another plain drain hole. Check to make sure those are in place.

    You don't mention if your car has a rear spoiler or not, but depending on which one you have (if you do) it will distinctly change the aerodynamics of the car and cause some of the problems you are mentioning. (That's why Datsun was puting some of those spoilers on the car as well.)

    How about the drainage holes in the spare tire well?

    Your sheet metal around the back of the rear tires, is it undamaged and the seal on the seams intact?

    Are you sure the exhaust fumes are coming from the outlet of the muffler and not due to a leak in the system tubing leading to the muffler?

    Just my 2
    Enrique

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    After YEARS of fumes I loosened the catch on the car that the latch catches.I pressed down on the rear hatch and opened the hatch.I then moved the catch down just a fraction as pushing down seated it to the top of the latch.That made sure I was securing at the bottom of the latch.I now only close the hatch with a window or door open as the pressure seal is so good.NO MORE FUMES!! As the new gasket seats and the natural movement of the car this will be required again at a future date.

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    HLS30165540
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    Default

    While I was taking my Zed apart I noticed a few places that fumes could get into. Check the fuel filler hose. Where it goes through the lower section of the quarter panel. It's supposed to have a gasket there. Mine was deteriorated and I had about a 1/4 inch gap. Also as Steve mentioned the two grommets at the rear lower end of the hatch could suck some fumes into the cabin area. And another place would be the emergency brake lever. There is a big gap there where the lever meets the sheetmetal. Maybe also check the shift boots.

    Good luck!
    The 1973 240Z 165540 Slightly modified. L28, 5sp, cam, headers, MSD 6AL, power windows, power door locks, leather seats, custom this and custom that.

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    Default

    i replaced my muffler a few days ago , put a new type if tip on it. Now i have fumes



    gonna replace it in the next few days

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    Had a major problem with my previous 260z that had been damaged at the back , and fumes came in all the time Escanlon is right around that area where the antenna connects to the car is also a major place of annoyances.

    Escanlon do you know if the 432 Spoiler also known as the BRE rear wing will improve the car fumes wise or if it makes it worse as I was considering one of these but was put off by the drilling involved. If it has a health improvement factor it may be something to consider although my Z isn't very bad unless you have a window down and have been giving it alot of stick with the choke half out.

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    Registered User tanny's Avatar
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    Is it possible that through some odd aerodynamic eddying that the fumes could creep up along side the body and get sucked into the open window, or has that been definitely eliminated as a source? Doesn't sound likely, but...... Victor.

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    Default Just a theory

    What the status of the rubber pieces that seal the shifter/tranny hole?The theory is "what if" you lay your seats forward and put one of those 30" or so box fans in the car.You would seal the window where the power cord went thru.With the fan on inside the car you then go around the outside of the car seams/openings with soap foam.Wouldn't we think that we would see blowing bubble or some activity at the leaks?----Just a theory.
    Last edited by Daniel; 08-08-2003 at 07:54 AM.

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    Registered User tanny's Avatar
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    The box fan would just circulate the air inside the car and would not increase the interior pressure. However, you could stick the blower end of a shop vac through the window and seal it and that would definitely blow air out of any leaky areas. Victor.

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    O.K. new theory.Use a cardboard box and duct tape.make a duct that connects the box fan to the INTAKE of the fan and attach to the window,the fan is now outside the car.With the fan on high ,now drawing air from the car,Use plastic wrap, like from the kitchen and cover an area at a time letting static cover the opening where gasket are supposed to be doing there jobs.Now we have negative air flow.We would think the wrap would respond as to the problem areas.---Just a theory---

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    Registered User tanny's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Better yet, lock a cigar smoker inside the z with 10 boxes of smuggled Cuban cigars, have him light up, then either look for smoke leaking out of any suspect areas or just sniff around all the seals and if you smell something like cat s--t, you know you've found the leak. Victor.

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    Originally posted by tanny
    just sniff around all the seals and if you smell something like cat s--t, you know you've found the leak. Victor.
    Amen to that I can't stand cigarette's or cigars and the smell is the worst part.

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    Even better - go to central asia and get a malcontented religious fanatic to step inside a car for a protest 'self-immolation' and see where the smoke emerges. I know that's not funny, especially since I own a near mint 240 that is undriveable due to the fumes. I am working on it.

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    You could perform a similar test with something a bit more pleasing to the nose than a cigar. How about some incense instead? Just a thought.
    =Enigma=
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    i dont know if you guys thought of using a fog machine inside the z that might help to determine where the leak enters from its better than that maguyver idea of using duct tape and card board and 30 other things............very simple fog machine,cord,car on jack stands so u can go under tha car and check there also and you can find the leak from every wich angle

  20. #20
    240Z Elec. Upgrade guy Zs-ondabrain's Avatar
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    And don't forget............

    1) the drain tube for your power antenna.
    2) wheel well area, mainly the DOGLEG See attached picture, this is what I'm dealing with before I shoot primer before the paint job.
    3) The fog machine is an excellent idea, you can rent one from a party supply store or music store that supplys lights and such for small cover bands.

    It only leaves a powdery residew which can easily be blown out later on.

    I get the same problem with mine but every detail is being looked over as I do the body work for the upcoming paint job.


    Isn't this lovely, found it while sanding out what I thought was a paint bubble.
    Turns out that it's a great spot for exhaust to come in, time for more sheet metal.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	dogleg rought outer area.JPG 
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