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Thread: Classic Motorsports "top 10" Japanese Race Cars of all time!

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    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    Default Classic Motorsports "top 10" Japanese Race Cars of all time!


    I heard the May 2006 issue of Classic Motorsports magazine has a
    feature story about the "10 Best Japanese Race Cars of All Time."

    What's your list?

    Maybe if we can get enough support, Classic Motorsports magazine will
    be able to get the cars on your list to the Mitty at Road Atlanta in
    April.
    Moderators I think this would be a great poll and CMM is looking to put this group of cars together at the Mitty!!

    My list starts a follows:

    1) BRE #46 240Z /BRE #03 240Z
    2) BRE #46 510
    3) BSR #33 240Z
    4) BSR #33 CP Roadster
    5) BRE #46 Roadster
    6) Shelby Toyota 2000
    7) BRE Off Road 240Z
    8) BSR 280ZX
    9) BRE Off Road 510
    10) Scoville Datsun Roadster

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    Torch Wielding Villager gogriz91's Avatar
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    I would say the 240 and the 510 campaigned by BRE would be at the top of lthe list with Bob Sharp's ride up there too.

    What's the good word from Nissan about sending you and some vehicles from the West Coast to the Mitty?
    '73 HLS30 129806 ; L-28, street cam, SUs, 5-speed, Koni's, Suspension techniques springs, swaybars, 3.90 R200 LSD

    Heavily medicated for your protection

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    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    Sadly, it has been very quiet....I have not gotten any response what so ever from Nissan.

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    Torch Wielding Villager gogriz91's Avatar
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    Would a strategically placed email barrage to the right person(s) help at all?

    I've gotta believe if Nissan knew that CMM was trying to put this together, they'd help out?
    '73 HLS30 129806 ; L-28, street cam, SUs, 5-speed, Koni's, Suspension techniques springs, swaybars, 3.90 R200 LSD

    Heavily medicated for your protection

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    Datsun/Nissan Enthusiast pimp1911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gogriz91
    Would a strategically placed email barrage to the right person(s) help at all?

    I've gotta believe if Nissan knew that CMM was trying to put this together, they'd help out?


    +1 on this suggestion.
    72 240Z HLS30 -49420

    Dewayne

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    '71 240Z, '78 280Z jmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimp1911
    +1 on this suggestion.
    +1 Agreed.
    Mark
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    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    Sign up and let CMM know how you feel!

    Here is a link to their forum, and the information regarding the Mitty.


    http://www.grmotorsports.com/board/v...ic.php?t=14236

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    Datsun/Nissan Enthusiast pimp1911's Avatar
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    Done. Signed up and left my 2 cents. Will turn my 2 cents into 25 dollars if need be. Lol.
    72 240Z HLS30 -49420

    Dewayne

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    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    Hey I appreciate this, please be sure to let CMM know what your interested in seeing at the Mitty...DATSUNS!!!

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    Admin Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron carter
    Moderators I think this would be a great poll and CMM is looking to put this group of cars together at the Mitty!!
    Hey Ron,

    I don't have a problem if you want to post a poll on this topic. But, make sure you have a good list of cars so people can pick from them. I could see this list becoming pretty long. It would be a great poll.

    Go ahead and post it on the "Front Page Polls" forum when you have a list ready.
    Mike

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    Torch Wielding Villager gogriz91's Avatar
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    I just posted something on that thread that hopefully Ron McDonald will see and respond to. Hell Ron, I'd send you a $100 to defray costs if you were willing to make the trip just to see your cars and meet you and whoever else was willing to make the journey.
    '73 HLS30 129806 ; L-28, street cam, SUs, 5-speed, Koni's, Suspension techniques springs, swaybars, 3.90 R200 LSD

    Heavily medicated for your protection

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    '72 240Z(G) 3.2L
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    Default Nissan Nyet

    Don't be holding your breath expecting any support form Nissan for the Mitty (or for anything else either). But before I go into more detail on that here's some info on a few of the cars mentioned.

    The owner of the 240/280 #33 BSN, the 900hp 280ZXTT, the 300ZX single turbo, and Tom Cruise's SCCA 300ZX Showroom Stock cars will be at the Mitty. He was not intenting on bringing any of these and was instead going to be driving 5 different vintage cars. He may make room for one of them.

    The Cruise car won't be ready until early June, the 280ZXTT hasn't been started in years and the 300ZXT is waiting on the custom build crankshaft to be shipped. That leaves the #33 car which was run at The Glen last year and could be taken to the Mitty but not run hard (needs a few days with the BSN original engine builder, along with a set of tires and a suspension tune-up).

    There might be another Japanese race car of interest in the owners' collection and I'm trying to find out what it is and in what shape it's in.

    Now as to Nissan, a little background. There are three entities involved, Nissan North America Nissan Motorsports, and NISMO. They have different agendas and staffing. Nissan NA and the MS folks I believe have already announced they are supporting a truck race event the same weekend and are not available to help out. NISMO's answer to the question was also negative.

    After seeing the promotion of the Mitty in CMM's last month, I contacted the Executive Director of the Z Car Clubs of America with a set of simple questions:

    1) Would Nissan (any or all three) provide some support or attend the Mitty?

    2) Was there a communication process in place that allows the ZCCA and Nissan to exchange information pertaining to events like these?

    3) Would the ZCCA assist in getting the message of the Mitty (and similar events) to others and help to coordinate things?

    The answer to all three was, no.

    Nissan (NA, MS, and NISMO) have either no interest, couldn't see a reason to do so, or are too caught up in the headquarters' move from LA to Nashville. As to the Z clubs standing in for Nissan and carrying the company banner, that was a local dealer issue.

    I got to wondering how many Z owners (1970 to 2005) own other Nissan vehicles and whether that might be point to raise with them in the future. It was Nissan that brought up the issue of ROI (Return on Investment) at the last ZCCA convention when the subject of convention funding was mentioned.
    Given the amount of funding they provide, I calculated that Nissan had made at least that much in profit from the 350s, Titans and other Nissan vehicles parked in the hotel lot alone. I also got to re-thinking my choice of two replacement vehicles I will be purchasing this year.

    There is no formal means of communication between the ZCCA and Nissan that would cover events such as this. Nissan makes up its' mind and does what is in its' own interest. No schedule of the events Nissan will be doing or not doing is given out (or it seems asked for either). The ZCCA was unaware that Nissan was not going or that there as a Japanese marque weekend for the Mitty. I asked if Nissan would welcome the ZCCA's involvement to help promote the event harder but there was no real interest at all to see what Nissan wanted or didn't want.

    The ZCCA is made up of local clubs and has fewer than 10 people who are elected or appointed to the Executive Committee that oversees all ZCCA business. In this manner ZCCA member clubs can decide to promote and/or put on any number of events like say going to the Mitty. Local clubs are the main players in any Z related event.

    That said, I was not able to get the ZCCA to see a potential benefit to promoting Zs and other Nissan products at the Mitty nor could I get them to see the benefit to having something like the Mitty coordinated at a higher level than just at the local club level. Not controlled but coordinated through increased communication, website promotions, etc. Even a simple email to clubs in say a 500 mile diameter of the Mitty asking what their plans were, did they need help getting the word out, etc. A "ZCCA" banner to be displayed at the Mitty? A follow-up article to be written with pics to be submitted to CMM? Oh, well......

    I hope to be there in my 240 Datsun anyway.
    if a little knowledge can make you dangerous, I'm a little dangerous

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    '71 240Z, '78 280Z jmark's Avatar
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    Sad state of affairs. Nissan is worried about the NASCAR Truck event......Funny their newsletter I just got promotes the Z and its heritage.

    http://www.nissanusa.com/form/0,,act...03&Creative=19

    Click on the Z and follow the links. Ron is that you & your BRE Z in one of the pics?
    Last edited by jmark; 02-14-2006 at 02:00 PM.
    Mark
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    ++++++++ HS30-H's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron carter
    My list starts a follows:

    1) BRE #46 240Z /BRE #03 240Z
    2) BRE #46 510
    3) BSR #33 240Z
    4) BSR #33 CP Roadster
    5) BRE #46 Roadster
    6) Shelby Toyota 2000
    7) BRE Off Road 240Z
    8) BSR 280ZX
    9) BRE Off Road 510
    10) Scoville Datsun Roadster
    Ron,

    Don't take this as a personal dig, but I notice you don't have a single Japanese-prepped / Japanese-driven / 'Works' purpose-built race car in your list.........

    Every single car in your list appears to be a car modified from a standard production road car - as opposed to a limited-run homologation special or 'real' ( read: purpose designed ) race car. They also all appear to be cars that raced exclusively in the USA.

    OK - so the purpose behind this is to lobby the organisers of the Mitty to include ( invite / sponsor / subsidise? ) some certain cars in their event, and we have to take the thread title with a pinch of salt - yes?

    Therefore it would ( surely? ) be a good idea to lobby for cars that actually still exist........, and have a good chance of showing up should they be invited - yes?

    But still, it would be nice to see some cars from outside the USA domestic race scene being included in a list with the title "10 Best Japanese Race Cars of All Time."..........

    I think that needed to be said.

    Good luck all the same.
    Alan T.

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    '71 240Z, '78 280Z jmark's Avatar
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    It would be awesome to see some works 240Z's brought over and demod for everyone.
    Mark
    '71 240Z White 904
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    '78 280Z Wine Red Metallic 611
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    IZCC #13834 CZC #5664
    '07 Nismo 350Z Silver Alloy Serial #0007
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    I bought an '05 Pathfinder last summer and just got a customer comment card after 6 motnhs of ownership. I guess I'll add a line or two about their support for their grassroots racing legacy.
    '73 HLS30 129806 ; L-28, street cam, SUs, 5-speed, Koni's, Suspension techniques springs, swaybars, 3.90 R200 LSD

    Heavily medicated for your protection

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    Known Zitus carrier! hls30.com's Avatar
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    Nissan will use our free enthusiasm to their advantage because they know our enthusiasm is only augmented, not generated, by their active participation, and they have no intent of paying for something that they can obtain and use for free. In saying this I in no way mean to imply that no one should participate-I hope to be there-though probably not in my own Z(maybe my wife and son will let me use their pre-restoration Roadster).
    I would enjoy Nissans participation in the event from the standpoint of providing a couple of historic cars, and someone who knew about them.
    A non-sponsored active following does suggest more loyalty than a sponsored(payed) following.
    Will
    I would love to have the opportunity to see a vintage JDM car-or more than one!
    A Z is beautiful from any angle, I just happen to prefer to view from the drivers' seat!

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    Torch Wielding Villager gogriz91's Avatar
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    It seems like it would be a great venue to pair a BRE 240 with one of their R or S tune 350Z's, 5 generations of racing. If nothing else, they could sell a ton of NISMO labeled crap and probably cover their investemnt.
    '73 HLS30 129806 ; L-28, street cam, SUs, 5-speed, Koni's, Suspension techniques springs, swaybars, 3.90 R200 LSD

    Heavily medicated for your protection

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    I was going to post what Alan said, except it probably wouldn't be as well written. So I will just re-iterate. I'm not sure whether I should get angry or just laugh at this topic?? It is a kick in the face for real historians.

    And by the way, if you wanted to make a poll, just DO IT.

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    tell you what Alan and Alpha, you can add to this post. Who would you choose?! I will put together a poll with a mixture of your suggestions and my suggestions..

    I will tell you that I am NOT a student of the international Datsun scene so other than Big Sam I dont know who you would want to include.

    Feel free to chime in and add something instead of complaining. What I listed was MY list, and are MY choices. Feel free to add yours.

    Ron

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    Torch Wielding Villager gogriz91's Avatar
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    My motto at work is no surprise...just dissapointment. I'm not surprised Nissan isn't going to put any effort into showing the flag at the Mitty, I'm just dissapointed because the decision chain that lead to a no answer from 3 separate sectors of the company would have made a great albeit dark episode of Seinfeld. Remember, Mr K was a pariah in the organization and was sent to America in part to get him out of the home office, no surprise...just dissapointment.
    '73 HLS30 129806 ; L-28, street cam, SUs, 5-speed, Koni's, Suspension techniques springs, swaybars, 3.90 R200 LSD

    Heavily medicated for your protection

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    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    wow gnosez, you hit the nail on the head....I think it is a budget thing with the upcoming move.

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    Default Nissan vs BMW/Porsche/Jaguar

    Ron - one of the speeches made during the election campaign for the ZCCA Exc. Director position talked about moving the ZCCA closer to that of the BMW, Porsche, Miata, and Jaguar clubs. Then and today I seriously doubt anyone (other than me) has taken the time to put together a table listing the various ways in which our clubs operate and how our corporate sponsors support us be it at the local dealership, regional or national level.

    Even discounting the differences in earnings and expendable income between Nissan and these other brands, Nissan and/or the ZCCA has a long way to go to even see the field these boys play on. And the amount the ZCCA gets from Nissan wouldn't buy a fully loaded Sentra. That said without Nissan at the conventions, the other vendors (TOYO, Bose, etc.) would have no reason to show up either and their funding would be sorely missed as well.

    Given the number of people at Niassn uninterested in what we do I for one have no confidence a champion will emerge. I would love to be wrong on this however. When Mr. K isn't able to come to the conventions I fear that Nissan will drop out as fast as our Zs are......
    if a little knowledge can make you dangerous, I'm a little dangerous

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    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    gnosez,

    I suspect Mr K will make this his last Z convention, and that will all but kill the national convention and severely cripple the ZCCA.

    I have had discussions with Chris Wenzel and have warned him that such a situation is a distinct possibility, and that it will effect the 07 convention it FL.

    Director position talked about moving the ZCCA closer to that of the BMW, Porsche, Miata, and Jaguar clubs.
    Case in point, 2 years ago at the LA Auto show, Porsche rolls out the production based Carrera GT. Their display is an homage to the cars that came before the new models. They have old 912's next to Carrera 4's, a Porsche spider from a museum...a few misc vintage race cars and their finest new cars all mixed together. Here is a company that supports its roots. The POC is one of the finest clubs anywhere with strong ties to racing.

    This year at the All Import show in Long Beach, Toyota shows up with a semi full of beautiful rare Toyota's including a 2000 GT. Nissan does nothing. Although in attendance there are more Datsuns than any other marque.

    Nissan, feels that they cant or should not support us. They are not Promoting DATSUN, they are promoting NISSAN. They feel that it is not worth the investment to promote their past because they are not selling DATSUNS any more.

    It just kills me, a manufacture needs to realize that someone who has purchased a Datsun / Nissan once is likely to do so again. Why do they think it is not necessary to promote their heritage and consumer confidence!?

    I purchased a 05 Armada! I cant tow my Datsun race cars with a Toyota! come on!!!

    Regardless, I have gone out of my way to help Nissan when they have asked, and they have asked a few times. My car has been in a few Nissan advertisements and on their web site....I would hope that one day soon they would realize that Datsun history is important to the Nissan brand.

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    My dearest Ron and gnosez,

    Knock it off with the bad karma. Mr K. will be at the 2007 convention because Chris Wenzel and eight other guys are busting their ass to see that it happens. The Princess and I wouldn't miss it. In addition, Mr. Wenzel is busting his ass to see that championship Nissans and championship drivers attend the convention. He has his own list and it doesn't stop at ten cars. Look for him at the Mitty and Dallas. He's looking for cars to invite. He'll bring his BMWCCA and PCA experience to the table - gladly. Things are changing in the Z world and it's time to start thinking outside the box for ways to present our events. Return-on-investment is what it is all about. "Drive a Datsun - Then Decide".

    With all due respect,

    Her Majesty the 26th
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    ++++++++ HS30-H's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron carter
    tell you what Alan and Alpha, you can add to this post. Who would you choose?! I will put together a poll with a mixture of your suggestions and my suggestions..

    I will tell you that I am NOT a student of the international Datsun scene so other than Big Sam I dont know who you would want to include.

    Feel free to chime in and add something instead of complaining. What I listed was MY list, and are MY choices. Feel free to add yours.

    Ron
    Ron,
    This thread seems to have very little in common with its title now. And that's not a complaint, that's an observation.

    In view of the fact that the thread has turned into a plea for Nissan's participation in / sponsorship of an American 'historic' car event, I came up with the following:

    OK, here's a list of TEN cars. All of them are currently owned by Nissan and NISMO in Japan, and all of them are in running order and can be demonstrated at something close to full racing speed on a race track.
    They would need to be brought over from Japan to the USA along with a skeleton staff of mechanics and spares to run them, but I would not have thought that this was an unsurmountable problem logistically or financially.
    They might need two or three Japanese drivers that are familiar with them too. I would choose Moto Kitano and Haruto Yanagida, as between them they have driven the majority of these cars either in period, or at Japanese events within the last few years. These two are part of Nissan's racing heritage ( whether they like it or not ) and ought to be interviewed by a few English-speaking journalists before they forget more than they remember......

    *R380-II - GR8 engine - 1967.
    *R381 - Chevrolet V8 engine - 1968.
    *R382 - GRX-3 V12 engine - 1969.
    *Skyline GT-R ( KPGC10 ) - S20 engine - 1971.
    *Cherry X-1 ( KPE10 ) - A12 engine - 1973.
    *Sunny Excellent ( KPB110 ) - LZ14 engine - 1973.
    *Fairlady 240ZR ( HS30 ) - LY28 engine - 1973.
    *Skyline Super-Silhouette - ( KDR30 ) - LZ20B engine - 1983.
    *NP35 - VRT35 NA V12 DOHC engine - 1992.
    *Group A Calsonic Skyline GT-R ( BNR32 ) - RB26DETT engine - 1993.

    Now, who wouldn't want to see that group fired up and driven hard?

    This is not my "Dream Team" by any means; I could easily come up with a list of over 100 Japanese race cars that I would like to see driven hard on a race track once again - but 95% of them don't exist any more. The remaining 5% still exist but are not all in full running / racing order. That list would only start to approach the title of this thread, and it would be fun to discuss - but I'm trying to be practical here.

    The above ten cars COULD be sent virtually anywhere in the world to be demonstrated. Probably too late for the Mitty, but people need to be lobbying NOW for events two or three years in the future. Many of the major auto manufacturers in the world now participate in events such as these, and do it as a part of their advertising and promotions budget. The current regime at Nissan need to do it too. Even one or two special ( rarely seen / historic ) cars would be better than nothing, and would generate many column inches of free coverage that would otherwise have to be paid for. Nissan are still struggling internally over matters such as these ( and they still don't have a proper museum in their homeland ) but they need to catch up with their peers and the time to start is now.

    Alan T.

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    '71 240Z, '78 280Z jmark's Avatar
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    Not to highjack this great topic, but where is the 2007 convention being held in FL. I might have to try to make this one.
    Mark
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    Well!

    Her Majesty barked a little? Sorry guys. I'll stuff a sock in her muffler.

    The presentation that will be made in Dallas from the Florida Z Association will be Daytona, the first week of October 2007. If the ZCCA approves of our plans and budget, we'll be cranking. I'm director of the car show and our plan is to hold it in the garage area of Daytona International Speedway. Come to the Dallas convention and meet our group.

    Just in the United States, Nissan holds an outstanding racing record and Daytona is no exception to the winning streak. For example:
    the 1990 IMSA GTP champion ZX-T GTP/Electramotive
    the 1991 Daytona 24-hour 2nd place finisher R90CK
    the 1992 Daytona 24-hour winner R91CP driven by Hasemi, Hoshino, and Suzuki
    the 1994 Daytona 24-hour winner 300ZX Cunningham

    These would have to be considered for the list.

    Chris
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  29. #29
    1978 280Z (stock) TomoHawk's Avatar
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    This is a can of worms, Ron. You're going to have to put up with all the unrelated comments, then get your amended list into a poll.

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    '71 240Z, '78 280Z jmark's Avatar
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    Chris,

    Daytona, FL first week in Oct. 2007! Count me in! Let me know if you need any volunteer help. I'd be glad to help take pics. Make sure you get Ron's BRE 240Z there too. I bet Greg Ira (gira) would display/run his EP 240Z. He and the car are in FL. Guy Marvin has a real nice ITS 240Z as well.
    Last edited by jmark; 02-15-2006 at 01:55 PM.
    Mark
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  31. #31
    another classic car guy EricB's Avatar
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    R30 Super Silhouette in the states AND running?
    Gosh I think I would just fall over backwards from the sight...

    It was already pretty special to have the Mazda techs fire up and warm up one of the 787B at Laguna Seca Historics a couple years ago, but when later in the day Paul Frere took it out on the track for some demo laps... aaaahhhh

    And then last year Toyota brought an old IMSA Celica, next to a couple year old JGTC Castrol Supra, and the '99 TS020 #3 car that should have won the race was it not for a flat tire. They brought them but they didn't run them. Still though any chance to marvel at the TS020 is a great day as far as I'm concerned... Unless there's really no "car guys" or "car gals" at the head of Nissan I also don't understand what's taking them so long to get on the Historic bandwagon outside of Japan.

    How could a manufacturer NOT want to participate in the Goodwood Festival of Speed, Revival, or Monterey Historics if they were only going to do one event outside of their home country... Go figure... Someone copy this link and forward it to your friends that work at Nissan and let it hopefully go up the corporate chain to someone who cares too.

    Heck, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I heard a rumour that Honda was going to drag some of its historic racing cars out to its own booth for Monterey Historics '06... That would be pretty sweet as well.

    -e
    -e

  32. #32
    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    OK, here's a list of TEN cars. All of them are currently owned by Nissan and NISMO in Japan, and all of them are in running order and can be demonstrated at something close to full racing speed on a race track.
    They would need to be brought over from Japan to the USA along with a skeleton staff of mechanics and spares to run them, but I would not have thought that this was an unsurmountable problem logistically or financially.
    They might need two or three Japanese drivers that are familiar with them too. I would choose Moto Kitano and Haruto Yanagida, as between them they have driven the majority of these cars either in period, or at Japanese events within the last few years. These two are part of Nissan's racing heritage ( whether they like it or not ) and ought to be interviewed by a few English-speaking journalists before they forget more than they remember......

    *R380-II - GR8 engine - 1967.
    *R381 - Chevrolet V8 engine - 1968.
    *R382 - GRX-3 V12 engine - 1969.
    *Skyline GT-R ( KPGC10 ) - S20 engine - 1971.
    *Cherry X-1 ( KPE10 ) - A12 engine - 1973.
    *Sunny Excellent ( KPB110 ) - LZ14 engine - 1973.
    *Fairlady 240ZR ( HS30 ) - LY28 engine - 1973.
    *Skyline Super-Silhouette - ( KDR30 ) - LZ20B engine - 1983.
    *NP35 - VRT35 NA V12 DOHC engine - 1992.
    *Group A Calsonic Skyline GT-R ( BNR32 ) - RB26DETT engine - 1993
    Sadly Nissan will not even haul the BRE 510 across the country, so I would not count on a contigency from Japan.


    Alan, this is a great list of Nissan /Nismo cars. a brief explanation of their place in history for those of us who dont know would be apreciated. Upon receipt I will put the poll together.

    The above ten cars COULD be sent virtually anywhere in the world to be demonstrated. Probably too late for the Mitty, but people need to be lobbying NOW for events two or three years in the future. Many of the major auto manufacturers in the world now participate in events such as these, and do it as a part of their advertising and promotions budget. The current regime at Nissan need to do it too. Even one or two special ( rarely seen / historic ) cars would be better than nothing, and would generate many column inches of free coverage that would otherwise have to be paid for. Nissan are still struggling internally over matters such as these ( and they still don't have a proper museum in their homeland ) but they need to catch up with their peers and the time to start is now.
    Alan, very well put, Nissan is sadly behind the curve here. I dont know who can right the ship....

    Knock it off with the bad karma. Mr K. will be at the 2007 convention because Chris Wenzel and eight other guys are busting their ass to see that it happens.
    Your right, and I will....I agree 26th, Chris and his team are busting butt to make this happen, and I want to support them in any way possible. This is not the time or the place for this....


    the 1990 IMSA GTP champion ZX-T GTP/Electramotive
    the 1991 Daytona 24-hour 2nd place finisher R90CK
    the 1992 Daytona 24-hour winner R91CP driven by Hasemi, Hoshino, and Suzuki
    the 1994 Daytona 24-hour winner 300ZX Cunningham
    Chris these will be added to the list as well, thanks for your input, hope to see you at the Mitty!

  33. #33
    Registered User Gee's Avatar
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    I wouldn't be able to name 10 cars, but I would have thought the R32 Godzillas that appeared at Bathurst some years ago would be up amongst that list somewhere.

    They were winning so easily they were banned..

    Alan, I'd be interested in learning more about the cars you mentioned as well.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron carter
    Alan, this is a great list of Nissan /Nismo cars. a brief explanation of their place in history for those of us who dont know would be apreciated. Upon receipt I will put the poll together.
    OK Ron, here is my list again - this time to follow up with photos and brief explanations:

    *R380-II - GR8 engine - 1967.
    *R381 - Chevrolet V8 engine - 1968.
    *R382 - GRX-3 V12 engine - 1969.
    *Skyline GT-R ( KPGC10 ) - S20 engine - 1971.
    *Cherry X-1 ( KPE10 ) - A12 engine - 1973.
    *Sunny Excellent ( KPB110 ) - LZ14 engine - 1973.
    *Fairlady 240ZR ( HS30 ) - LY28 engine - 1973.
    *Skyline Super-Silhouette - ( KDR30 ) - LZ20B engine - 1983.
    *NP35 - VRT35 NA V12 DOHC engine - 1992.
    *Group A Calsonic Skyline GT-R ( BNR32 ) - RB26DETT engine - 1993.


    First photo is the recently-refurbed Nissan R380-II pictured at the last NISMO Festival, which took place in December 2005 at Fuji Speedway in Japan. This car is claimed to be the actual car that set a great number of international speed records at Yatabe in 1967 ( the second record-breaking run for the R380 at Yatabe ).

    Second is the also recently-refurbed Nissan R381, again pictured at the 2005 NISMO Festival. This car is the 1968 Japan Grand Prix winner, and the innovative twin-pitching 'active' rear wing is fully functional.

    Third up is the Nissan R382, which was rebuilt a couple of years ago. This car is the 1969 Japan Grand Prix winner. The 6-litre GRX-3 V12 DOHC engine had to be built up from several display engines that had not run for over thirty five years.
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  35. #35
    ++++++++ HS30-H's Avatar
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    Next group:

    Nissan Cherry X-1 ( KPE10 ) - this car competed in the 'TS' race of the 1973 Japan Grand Prix meeting. Its A12 4-cylinder OHV engine was a low-tech 'screamer', and the TS races were where Nissan duked it out with their rivals at Toyota.

    Nissan Sunny Excellent ( KPB110 ) - this car was the winner of the 'TS' class race at the 1973 Japan Grand Prix meeting. Its 16-valve DOHC LZ14 engine was essentially a Formula Pacific race engine, producing 200ps on Nissan's 'ECGI' injection setup at over 10,000 rpm. Again, this class was the arena where Nissan fought their battles with Toyota - winning hearts and minds on the race track in the hope of winning sales in the showroom.

    Fairlady 240ZR ( HS30 ) 1973 - this car has a slightly mysterious history, but was built as a full 'Works' Group 4 'aerodynamic' race car in-period. It ended up as one of the Nissan Racing School fleet of pensioned-off race cars and then sat in NISMO's collection for many years. A few years ago it was restored by NISMO, and it features many trick original Works parts - such as its 'LY28' SOHC crossflow engine. The car is painted to replicate a famous livery used by the Works cars in period. Now usually driven at NISMO events by arch exponent of the S30-series Works circuit race cars Mr Haruto Yanagida ( of 'Central 20' renown ) who still drives with verve and excellent speed.

    Skyline Super-Silhouette - ( KDR30 ) Tomica / Hasemi Motorsport - this car should need no introduction. Built for the short-lived 'Super Silhouette' formula in 1982/83 - this car dominated the series. Its LZ20B engine was turbocharged to produce 570ps and a distinctly on/off nature ( whilst spurting huge flames from its side muffler outlet )that led to the necessity of a unique driving style from pilot Masahiro Hasemi.
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  36. #36
    ++++++++ HS30-H's Avatar
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    Next:

    Nissan NP35 - this closed-roof sports car was built in-house at NISMO for the 1992 JSPC. Its 3.5 litre normally-aspirated VRT35 V12 DOHC engine produced 630ps at over 12,000 rpm is a joy to hear on song. I selected this car because it is unique, it is running and active, and I think it is absolutely beautiful.

    Killing two Skylines with one stone: The KPGC10 Skyline GT-R was the model that brought the majority of wins in the GT-R's famous '50 Victories'. I think it needs very little explanation here, and surely an American ( or Australian, NZ, European, British..... ) audience would love to hear a race-tuned S20 engine on song? I don't suggest any particular car here, as privateers in Japan have some of the cleanest and fastest examples that are still active.
    The CALSONIC-sponsored Group A Nissan Skyline GT-R needs no intro here either. The CALSONIC-liveried cars were always the hottest Works entries with the latest updates and the most powerful engines. They also had - arguably - Nissan's hottest drivers at the wheel. They won so many races that the series had to have its rules changed. I watched these things make RS500 Cosworth Sierras and BMW M3s look like pedal cars at tracks like FISCO, Sugo, Tsukuba and Suzuka. They still look fast today. The CALSONIC-liveried cars are probably the most readily recognised, but the TAISAN / STP and Reebok liveried cars ran close, along with a gaggle of others.
    Not forgetting the 'Winfield' sponsored examples in Australia either.

    Again - as I have tried to make clear - the list I made consists of cars that COULD be taken anywhere in the world and run with little problem. Totally academic considering Nissan's intransigence, but a practical suggestion nonetheless........
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  37. #37
    Her Majesty the 26th 26th-Z's Avatar
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    Your post #34 collection is my favorite, Alan. Those are the cars of my youth - in awe of them to this day. I'm glad to see you post pictures of your favorites.
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  38. #38
    Datsaholic Mr Camouflage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gee
    I wouldn't be able to name 10 cars, but I would have thought the R32 Godzillas that appeared at Bathurst some years ago would be up amongst that list somewhere.

    They were winning so easily they were banned..
    Dont forget where the skyline racing started in Australia. Glen Seatons R31 skyline which took on the other group 1 touring cars (including holden V8's ) with its 4 cylinder fj20 turbo.
    www.nostalgictrio.com Skyline - Silvia - Fairlady Z
    www.ozdat.com The Australian Datsun site.
    www.cafepress.com/vintagedatsun

  39. #39
    philo "Z" opher Zedrally's Avatar
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    Alan,
    I'm surprised that you haven't included a "works" rally car!

    Or would that be best left as a different thread?
    Mike of the Mire

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    Bogged but not beaten

  40. #40

  41. #41
    ++++++++ HS30-H's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26th-Z
    I'm glad to see you post pictures of your favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zedrally
    I'm surprised that you haven't included a "works" rally car!
    As I mentioned before, this is not my personal all-time 'Top 10'. In fact, I don't think any of the particular cars I posted would be in my all-time top ten of Japanese race cars.......

    The list is intended as a practical suggestion for vehicles that are of historic interest, currently running, owned by either Nissan or NISMO in Japan, and could feasibly be taken anywhere in the world to be demonstrated.

  42. #42
    Deftly daft Alfadog's Avatar
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    Awesome information Alan. It never ceases to amaze me that these cars still exist and are run every now and then in Japan. Amaze is probably not the right word.... more like, ecstatic! For now, I can only hope Nissan Australia does something with the Winfield Skylines next year with the release of the new GT-R. Somehow I doubt it though. They wouldn't even let me park my 240Z next to the 350Z at the entrance of the hotel at it's official debut... "A Datsun?"

    Your comment about none of the aforementioned cars being in your top ten list makes me curious. Not even the R380-II? I realise I am going way off-"topic" here... but if you are not too busy I am sure I'm not the only one who would love to hear your impractical list

    Thankyou too Ron for letting this be a constructive thread. I wish you luck with your talks with Nissan.

  43. #43
    '71 240Z, '78 280Z jmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmark
    Chris,

    Daytona, FL first week in Oct. 2007! Count me in! Let me know if you need any volunteer help. I'd be glad to help take pics. Make sure you get Ron's BRE 240Z there too. I bet Greg Ira (gira) would display/run his EP 240Z. He and the car are in FL. Guy Marvin has a real nice ITS 240Z as well.
    Chris, PM me with the proposed dates for '07. Thanks
    Mark
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  44. #44
    WESTCOASTZRACER ron carter's Avatar
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    Thankyou too Ron for letting this be a constructive thread. I wish you luck with your talks with Nissan.
    Absolutely! The point is for everyone to share their opinion.

    One of the editors of Classic Motorsports Magazine (the title sponsor of the Mitty) asked a few of us to post on the boards to determine what are the 10 best Japanese race cars of all time. I am sure when he sent this around that he was referring to cars that could be found in the USA as they are looking to put that group of cars together for the mitty.(a little late but better than not at all).

    But for my own knowledge I wanted to know what is out there and a more global opinion. Which Alan and a few others provided.

    Regardless, I will forward the choices on the poll to Bill McDonald at CMM.

    And perhaps find a way to get to the Mitty afterall...

    R

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